AAND Committee Meeting

STANDING COMMITTEE ON ABORIGINAL AFFAIRS AND NORTHERN DEVELOPMENT

COMITÉ PERMANENT DES AFFAIRES AUTOCHTONES ET DU DÉVELOPPEMENT DU GRAND NORD

EVIDENCE

[Recorded by Electronic Apparatus]

Thursday, October 30, 1997

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[Translation]

The Chairman (Mr. Guy Saint-Julien (Abitibi, Lib.)): Thank you very much for coming this morning. We're delighted. I see that we have a quorum, that is eight members plus one. On our agenda today is the future business of the committee, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2). Item number 1 is the adoption of the First Report of the Sub-committee on Agenda and Procedure, a copy of which has been distributed to you.

The Sub-committee on Agenda and Procedure of the Standing Committee on Aboriginal Affairs and Northern Development has the honour to present its First Report to the Standing Committee.

The Sub-committee met on Tuesday, October 28, 1997 and agreed to recommend the following:

That witnesses from the territories wishing to make submissions on Bill C-6, an Act to provide for an integrated system of land and water management in the Mackenzie Valley, to establish certain boards for that purpose and to make consequential amendments to other Acts and Bill C-8, an Act respecting an accord between the Government of Canada and the Yukon Territory relating to the administration and control of a legislative jurisdiction in respect of oil and gas, be invited to participate by videoconference from Yellowknife and Whitehorse respectively.

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That the draft motion on the disposal of in camera transcripts, moved at the first meeting of the Committee, be withdrawn, and that the transcripts of in camera meetings be deposited in the National Archives in accordance with agreed practices.

That the Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development be invited to appear before the Committee to discuss the Main Estimates for 1997-98, following the completion of the Committee's study of Bills C-6 and C-8.

Thank you very much.

Are there any questions?

Mr. Konrad.

[English]

Mr. Derrek Konrad (Prince Albert, Ref.): I would just ask that the minister be here prior to November 24, if possible.

[Translation]

The Chairman: Mr. Konrad would like the Minister to come and testify before November 24, that is before the December 6 budget deadline.

Mr. Patry.

[English]

Mr. Bernard Patry (Pierrefonds—Dollard, Lib.): I'm looking at the schedule, and November 24 is on a Monday. Usually we have a problem having full committee on Mondays. It's not that I don't want to see the minister, but if we want to have a quorum when we meet with the minister to at least ask all the questions we have, maybe another date would be good. It's just that it's on a Monday.

Mr. Derrek Konrad: I suggested having a meeting with the minister prior to that date.

Mr. Bernard Patry: Okay. That would be fine.

I think the best solution would be to ask the chair and the clerk to contact the minister's office to try to get a date settled prior to November 24.

Mr. Derrek Konrad: That's why I didn't want to make it fixed. It would be at the minister's discretion.

The Chairman: Thank you.

[Translation]

Before November 24. Do you agree? Fine then. Thank you very much.

[English]

Mr. Bernard Patry: Mr. Chairman, we have a report. Do we accept the report? This proposition from my colleague, Mr. Konrad...is it going to be in the second part, when you say “Other business”, or will it be to amend this?

[Translation]

The Chairman: I would point out that the following is noted on the flip side:

That the Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development be invited to appear before the Committee to discuss the Main Estimates for 1997-98, following the completion of the Committee's study of Bills C-6 and C-8.

Mr. Konrad is proposing that the Minister testify before November 24. He is moving an amendment.

[English]

Mr. Bernard Patry: Yes, it's an amendment, because as it's written now it says, “following the completion of the Committee's study of Bills C-6 and C-8”. If we're finished studying the bills and we say they're going to be in contradiction, well, both will be in contradiction. That means we need to scrap “following the completion” and replace it with “before November 24”.

That's your proposition?

[Translation]

The Chairman: An amendment has been moved.

[English]

Mr. Derrek Konrad: If that works with the government's agenda, I'll move the amendment.

Mr. Bernard Patry: That's fine. It's just a technicality.

Mr. Derrek Konrad: We could have done both. Maybe we've done these anyway.

Mr. Bernard Patry: No, we agree.

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[Translation]

(Amendment agreed to)

The Chairman: Are we prepared to adopt the report as amended?

Mr. Bachand.

Mr. Claude Bachand (Saint-Jean, BQ): If we adopt the report, we are agreeing to hold a videoconference.

I have a few questions. In what order will the bills be examined? What is the deadline for submitting our list of proposed witnesses? I would like us to discuss briefly the days on which the Indian Affairs and Northern Development Committee will be sitting. In the previous Parliament, we sat on Tuesdays and Thursdays from 11 a.m. to 1 p.m. This schedule seemed to suit everyone just fine and it would suit me very well too. I would like us to discuss these three points, either at this stage or later on. It makes no difference to me, provided that we discuss them.

The Chairman: Can we begin with the easiest question, namely the scheduling of committee meetings?

Mr. Claude Bachand: Yes.

[English]

Mr. Bernard Patry: Can we first adopt the report? After that, under other business, we'll discuss it right away.

[Translation]

The Chairman: Is the Committee ready to adopt the report as amended?

(Motion agreed to)

The Chairman: Mr. Bachand moves that this Committee sit on Tuesdays and Thursdays from 11 a.m. to 1 p.m. Would you like coffee to be served as well, Mr. Bachand?

Mr. Claude Bachand: Absolutely. I thought that was already settled, but I will make the motion.

The Chairman: Mr. Patry.

[English]

Mr. Bernard Patry: There's no problem on the government side. That's the way it worked in the last Parliament. It worked very well. We didn't have any problem with these hours. The only thing is, for Bills C-8 and and C-6 it could be a little bit longer than these dates, because we have witnesses from western and eastern time zones.

But we fully agree with this. To answer right away this first question, when we are going start, it's the wish of the government side to start with Bill C-8 and then go to Bill C-6, starting first with the Yukon Act and then going to the Mackenzie Valley act, if it's agreeable to all parties.

The Chairman: What was your other question? You had a third one.

[Translation]

Mr. Claude Bachand: What is the deadline for submitting a list of witnesses from the Yukon since we are starting with them?

[English]

Mr. Bernard Patry: You should ask the clerk.

[Translation]

The Chairman: The clerk tells me that we could begin by inviting those who have already participated in the consultation process. If members would like us to invite certain witnesses or certain groups, I would ask them to submit their recommendations as soon as possible. We could start this way and then perhaps think about setting a deadline.

Ms. Hardy.

[English]

Ms. Louise Hardy (Yukon, NDP): I have a list of names, and my assistant has in the constituency taken some steps to inquire about further names for it as well.

[Translation]

The Chairman: Fine then. Thank you very much. Will you be giving us this list today or this week?

[English]

Ms. Louise Hardy: Yes, I have it.

The Chairman: Mr. Finlay.

Mr. John Finlay (Oxford, Lib.): Mr. Chairman, should we start with the witnesses and the videoconferencing or should we start with someone from the department responsible so that we can have both a general overview and time to ask some questions about the acts themselves? It seems to me that would sharpen things out for us in our minds and perhaps lead to a more useful use of time, rather than—

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[Translation]

The Chairman: Mr. Patry, on the same subject.

Mr. Bernard Patry: Yes, on the same subject,

[English]

I think it's the custom of any committee.... When we're talking about witnesses, first we ask the department to come in front of the committee to explain. We could ask questions of the senior people working within the department.

I think that's the first step. After that, it will be much easier for this committee to ask questions of our witnesses. This is just to be sure we properly understand the bill that's in front of this committee.

When you request all the witnesses, that includes DIAND witnesses. It would be preferable to see DIAND witnesses first of all. They would be the first ones presenting in front of this committee.

After that, you usually ask members of this committee if they have any witnesses to be heard. They should submit the list to the clerk, who will do everything in her power to have all these people heard in this committee.

[Translation]

The Chairman: The clerk will explain to us how the videoconferencing will work.

[English]

The Clerk of the Committee: The officials from the department have been contacted. They were told to be ready to appear before the committee possibly as early as Tuesday at 11 a.m.

On Tuesday afternoon, the fisheries committee is doing videoconferencing from Vancouver. They would be finished at 5.30 p.m. We would be able to use the equipment already set up in room 701 at half the price, because we would split the cost of installation with the fisheries committee.

So I have contacted some of the people in the Yukon: the Porcupine Caribou Management Board and the Inuvialuit Regional Corporation. I have a call out to the Yukon government office here in Ottawa. There are other calls out to see whether people could attend in Whitehorse for Tuesday evening. We would start at about 5.45 p.m. Ottawa time, which would be 2.45 p.m. in Whitehorse. That would be very convenient for the witnesses.

[Translation]

The Chairman: Mr. Bachand.

Mr. Claude Bachand: Mr. Chairman, would it be possible for the clerk who is coordinating the appearance of the witnesses to provide us with a list of proposed witnesses as names are added so that we can avoid any duplication? I see that our NDP colleagues already have a list. If I knew that the NDP or Mr. Patry had already put down on his list some of the names that I had in mind, this would spare me the effort of having to contact the same persons.

The Chairman: That's a good suggestion, namely that we be given an updated list of witnesses every day.

Mr. Claude Bachand: As soon as any names are added to the list.

The Chairman: Would you also like to have the group's telephone number?

Mr. Claude Bachand: No, as long as I know who is scheduled to appear.

The Chairman: Fine. Thank you very much for your good suggestion.

Are there any other questions? We are agreed therefore to start by inviting witnesses from the Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development and then potential groups. You will be receiving a daily updated list from now until next week.

Are there any further questions? Mr. Patry.

[English]

Mr. Bernard Patry: If I understand properly, the next meeting is scheduled for next Tuesday at 11 a.m. for DIAND. Then late in the afternoon, at about 5.45 p.m., we will have our first witnesses for this Yukon bill. That's fine. I just want to make it clear for everyone here. We'll arrange our schedule.

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[Translation]

The Chairman: The clerk informs me that the videoconference will be held in room 701 of La Promenade Building.

Thank you very much.

The meeting is adjourned.