CIIT Committee Meeting

     I'm calling the meeting to order.

    My apologies to all our witnesses for the technical difficulties that we've experienced today. We appreciate your patience. We will get the meeting under way.

    Welcome to meeting 89 of the Standing Committee on International Trade. Today's meeting is taking place in a hybrid format, pursuant to the Standing Orders. Members are attending in person in the room and remotely using the Zoom application.

    I would like to make a few comments for the benefit of witnesses and members. Please wait until I recognize you by name before speaking. For those online, please mute yourself when you are not speaking. For interpretation online, you have the choice, at the bottom of your screen, of floor, English or French. For those in the room, you can use the earpiece and select the desired channel.

    I would ask all participants to be careful when handling the earpieces in order to prevent feedback, which can be extremely harmful to interpreters and cause serious injuries. Please speak only into the microphone that your headset is plugged into. Place earbuds away from the microphone when they are not in use.

    All comments should be addressed through the chair. For members in the room, if you wish to speak, please raise your hand. For members on Zoom, please use the “raise hand” function. The clerk and I will manage the speaking order as best we can, and we would appreciate your patience and understanding. If any technical issues arise, please let me know immediately and we will suspend in order to ensure that interpretation is properly restored.

    All members have received a copy of the draft budget from the clerk. I will ask whether the committee is in agreement to adopt the budget, in the amount of $38,900, for the study of Canadian businesses in supply chains and global markets.

    Is everyone in agreement to adopt the budget?

     (Motion agreed to)

    The Chair: Pursuant to Standing Order 108(2) and the motion adopted by the committee on Tuesday, October 17, 2023, the committee is beginning its study of Canadian businesses in supply chains and global markets.

    We have very patient people with us today. From the Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development, we have Sara Wilshaw, chief trade commissioner; and David Hutchison, director general, trade portfolio strategy and coordination. From Export Development Canada, we have Mairead Lavery, president; and Stuart Bergman, vice-president and chief economist.

    Welcome to all. We will start with opening remarks and then proceed with rounds of questions.

    Ms. Wilshaw, I would invite you to make an opening statement of up to five minutes, please.

    Thank you, Madam Chair, for the opportunity to address—

    Madam Chair, I'm just wondering what we're doing. We have two panels but only one hour. How are we going to run the meeting today?

    I'd like to suggest that we could extend the meeting. We do have resources to extend the meeting until as late as 6:30, if the committee chooses to go along that line.

    I see that Mr. Cannings is ready for something different from a committee that late.

    What about going until 6 p.m.?

    Madam Chair, I have to drive to a commitment that's constituency-related.

    Could we bring back our second panel another day?

    It means we'll have to invite the officials back again.

     I have to tell you that we have a huge number of people and companies and so on who have indicated an interest in this study.

    We'll go to 6 p.m. Is everybody in agreement with that?

    An hon. member: No.

    They said no.

    As you know, I'm always very courteous to my colleagues, so I'll defer to them. I would suggest that if we're not going to go until 6 p.m. or 6:30, we use the first panel for the hour that we have, dismiss the second panel and apologize that they've come. We won't be able to hear from them today.

    That's what I would propose.

    That's a good suggestion, Mr. Seeback.

    To our second panel, we will have to invite you back as soon as the clerk can get that coordinated.

    We will just go forward with the current panel that we have before us, and we will adjourn at 5:30.

    Everybody is in agreement. Thank you very much.

     Ms. Wilshaw, we're back to you for five minutes of opening remarks, please.

     Thank you again, Madam Chair.

    As noted, I'm Sara Wilshaw. I'm the assistant deputy minister of international business development, investment and innovation at Global Affairs Canada. I'm also the chief trade commissioner. This means that I lead a network of almost one thousand employees at Global Affairs Canada, where we serve Canada from over 150 locations around the globe, as well as 600 employees in 14 offices across the country.

    I'm very pleased to speak about how the trade commissioner service, or the TCS, supports the integration of Canadian businesses into global value chains. The TCS is a client service organization, first and foremost. We aim to support the sustainable and equitable growth of Canada's economy by providing free services, support and funding to qualified Canadian exporters and innovators, educational institutions and foreign investors. With nearly two-thirds of Canada's GDP linked to international trade, our work helps to make Canada's trade and economy more resilient.

    The TCS generates real economic results for Canada. In the 2022‑23 fiscal year, the TCS provided over 52,000 distinct services to more than 11,000 Canadian businesses and clients. With that support, those clients achieved over 1,000 new international business deals and partnerships with an estimated value of $4 billion.

    In the same year, we supported foreign direct investment worth an estimated total of $16 billion and over 13,000 new jobs in Canada. Foreign multinationals are actually a really important part of the Canadian economy, accounting for over 60% of trade in goods and services. Not only does FDI contribute significantly to Canada's integration into global supply chains, but it also strengthens our domestic supply chains by acting as a stable source of demand for Canadian industry suppliers.

     It should be noted that the TCS shares this mandate with Invest in Canada and with provinces, territories and municipalities to promote FDI into Canada, just as we share the mandate to support exports with a number of other government departments, EDC, CCC and provincial and territorial counterparts.

    We know that Canadian companies that use TCS services export to nearly 25% more markets. They export 11.2% more product varieties and earn 19.8% more value than non-clients do. I should add that, of course, Canadian imports and Canadian direct investment abroad are not part of the core mandate of the trade commissioner service. We are outward-facing and focused on inbound investment primarily.

    In 2018, the Government of Canada launched the export diversification strategy, with a goal of increasing Canada's overseas exports by 50% by 2025. Canada is on track to meet that target, with the help of the TCS.

    Canadian businesses and clients that export their products to multiple markets seem less vulnerable to supply chain disruptions and to sudden changes in demand.

    Since over 90% of TCS clients are SMEs, our services can make the difference for a Canadian business being able to successfully enter a new market.

    In addition to diversifying where we do business, where we export, the TCS is also committed to diversifying who trades by providing targeted support for traditionally under-represented groups in trade.

    This work is all in the service of helping Canadian businesses integrate into global supply chains that will define key and emerging sectors for the future and promote Canadian prosperity.

    Supporting the expansion of Canadian businesses in high‑growth sectors of interest across the globe, such as the green and digital economy, is also in line with our commitment to responsible business conduct, or RBC, as highlighted in our strategy.

    To build on these successes, the TCS Canadian technology accelerators and some of our other flagship programs have been expanded to help more Canadian entrepreneurs find investors, customers and partners in innovation hubs all around the world. We have also expanded the Canadian international innovation program to help Canadians commercialize their innovations through international partnerships.

    Madam Chair, I just want to end by highlighting the TCS work in the Indo-Pacific region in particular, given the strategy and the focus on that area. With over 350 trade commissioners already based in the region, providing thousands of Canadian businesses with services and support, we have long recognized the importance of the Indo-Pacific to global economic growth. In support of that strategy, the TCS is organizing the team Canada trade missions to the region. We will have missions to Malaysia, Vietnam, South Korea, Indonesia and the Philippines coming up this year.

    As noted, we do all of this alongside a lot of partners and a lot of folks who are engaged in the international trading and investment-attraction space. We know that increased international business for Canadian companies is key to our future prosperity and to our economic security. We're proud to be helping Canadian businesses on that journey, and we look forward to adapting to their needs along their journey.

    Thank you.

    Thank you very much, Ms. Wilshaw.

    Ms. Lavery, you have five minutes, please.

    Thank you, Madam Chair.

    I also want to thank the committee members for inviting me to take part in this important study today.

    As president and CEO of EDC, I'm eager to discuss with you the work we do to support Canadian businesses in supply chains and international markets. I look forward to sharing data and insights on the context and the conditions in which Canadian businesses are operating. I'm joined today by the EDC chief economist, Stuart Bergman.

    As Canada's export credit agency, we operate with a mandate to support and grow the country's export trade. We do this through a suite of financial solutions to help mitigate risks for Canadian exporters and investors, as well as through knowledge products like webinars and digital content. Together, these offerings give Canadian companies the tools they need to reduce financial risk, and the capital to enter and invest in new markets with confidence and to grow internationally.

    As the committee may be aware, EDC operates on commercial terms, and throughout our 80-year history, we've been consistently profitable. We ensure complementarity with the private sector, both bankers and insurers.

    EDC's contribution to the Canadian economy relies on the hard work of exporters in virtually all sectors of the Canadian economy and companies of all sizes, from micro to large, as well as our under-represented groups in trade.

    In order to best serve all of these businesses, we have 16 offices across Canada, from British Columbia to Nova Scotia. To ensure that we are meeting the country's exporters where they want to go and where we see the greatest potential for businesses and for the Canadian economy, we have 23 representations in international markets, with three more scheduled to open in 2024. EDC is putting feet on the ground in so many regions and markets worldwide, and it's because of the growing number of Canadian companies operating in those markets, as well as the potential of those markets.

    We are confident that our medium-term and long-term plans will help make Canada and the world better through trade. In fact, last year, our economics team enlisted the support of Statistics Canada to help better understand the value proposition we provide to Canadian exporters. This seminal study found that Canadian exporters receiving EDC support generated 22% more revenue, had 15% higher employment and had 5% greater employee productivity than similar exporters that were not EDC customers.

    Still, as everyone in this room knows, Canadian businesses have faced many serious challenges for several years now.

    Although the direct effects of the pandemic and the war in Ukraine started to wane in 2023, we still saw high inflation, rising interest rates, another war, slowing domestic demand, and weaker-than-expected growth from our largest trading partner, the United States. These were real challenges that caused real difficulties for our customers, but at the same time, the breadth of international opportunities has never been greater. At EDC, we're working to ensure that the country's exporters are primed to seize the opportunity.

    For example, we're expecting to see Canada's natural resources and world-leading clean technologies play a key role in the ongoing global energy transition. EDC is a steadfast supporter of this sector, having worked with more than 440 Canadian clean-tech businesses in 2023. Together, we facilitated a record $12.2 billion in exports, foreign investment and trade-development activities for these companies.

    We are also seeing new commercial partnerships in rapidly growing regions, giving Canadian exporters more reasons to diversify beyond our long-standing trade partners. To support this opportunity, EDC has devoted teams to the markets and regions where we see local demand dovetail seamlessly with strong Canadian capabilities.

    Another significant opportunity lies in Canada's standing as one of the world's most agriculturally self-sufficient countries. This distinction means that Canada's agri-food supply chain has a critical role to play in feeding an increasingly resource-constrained world. Given Canada's abilities and strong reputation in the sector, EDC selected it as one of our priority sectors, alongside clean tech, advanced manufacturing and digital industries, as well as other natural resources.

    Thank you for giving me time to share some information regarding Export Development Canada and international trade.

     I look forward to offering more information and details as the meeting progresses.

    Thank you, Madam Chair.

    Thank you very much.

    We'll move on to our members.

    Mr. Martel, you have six minutes. Please proceed.

    I want to thank the witnesses for joining us.

    Thank you for your patience.

    In terms of Canadian business development, what interests and concerns me are the ports, especially the port of Vancouver. I have a question about that.

    Is the sound working?

    Mr. Martel, just give us a second here.

    Start again, and we'll see if it's better.

    I want to thank the witnesses for joining us.

    I'm concerned about the state of Canada's ports, particularly the port of Vancouver.

    I want to know the following. In your opinion, does the port of Vancouver hinder the development of Canadian businesses?

    We often hear that there are lines, that things take a long time, that the unloading process could be further modernized and that we're lagging behind other ports, particularly American ports.

    Do you think that Canada's ports, in their current state, hinder business development?

    Madam Chair, there's a problem with the interpretation.

    I'm listening to the French channel and I can hear the English interpretation. There's an issue with the transmission of the interpretation.

    Okay.

    The English channel was clear.

    We'll get there. Don't worry.

    Mr. Martel, can you say something in English?

    I keep stopping the timer, by the way, so you're not losing your time.

    Do I have to speak in English?

    What should I do?

    Say something in English.

    Do I have to speak in English?

    I'm not hearing French interpretation.

    Can you hear me now?

    We can hear the two interpreters, who are speaking at the same time. A man and a woman are speaking in English at the same time. We can hear the two interpreters speaking at the same time, but I still understood what you said.

    Okay.

    Go ahead if you want.

    Okay.

    The interpreter's mic may still be on.

    Mr. Martel, I'm going to make a suggestion. I'm going to ask you to start all over again because your time has been interrupted several times.

    Let's get you started with your six minutes.

    So I can speak French.

    Should I start again? Okay.

    When it comes to Canadian business development, I'm concerned about Canada's ports. We seem to have fallen far behind other ports, especially American ports.

    I would like to hear your comments on this.

    Are Canada's ports, particularly the port of Vancouver, hindering the development of Canadian businesses?

    Thank you very much for the question. I did understand.

    I am not hearing from our clients about this, so I can't speak to—

    I'm sorry to interrupt.

    We're not getting the English translation.

    Today is like the first day back from a year away or something. Nothing is working right today.

    Now it's okay.

    Ms. Wilshaw, would you like to finish? Have you completed your answer to that question?

     Very briefly, I would just say that it's probably a question better suited for Transport Canada officials, who I believe are on the second panel.

    I'd like to discuss the national trade corridors fund, or NTCF, announced in 2017 by Minister Garneau. This fund was supposed to support ports and businesses and increase trade in Canada. I'm hearing that people can no longer access the fund because the money disappeared in the blink of an eye. They're complaining, because it seemed like a good fund.

    Thank you again for the question. Unfortunately, again, I'm going to have to defer to my colleagues at Transport Canada, because they manage the national trade corridors fund. I don't have any visibility into that or the requests that have been made. I apologize.

    It's a shame. I had many questions about the port of Vancouver. I thought that this fund fell under economic development and international trade.

    When it comes to Export Development Canada, or EDC, which sectors are in greatest demand abroad?

    I can start, Madam Chair.

    In terms of the top sectors that we see by number of services offered by the trade commissioner service, there's ICT with 17% of the 52,000 services that we offered last year. Agri-food is second, then education, clean technologies, and life sciences, and then it drops from there. Those are the priority sectors that are in demand.

    Mairead, can you comment for your side?

    Thank you, Madam Chair.

    Perhaps I can split my answer into two, and certainly Stuart can add some more details.

    In terms of our exports today, they continue to be driven by energy, commodities—particularly agricultural commodities—metals, etc. Those are some of our big exporting sectors, including transportation. I think it's also worth noting that of Canada's exports to date, 18% relate to services. When we look at exports in general, 82% are goods and 18% are services. It's very important to remember that.

    If your question is around where the sectors of opportunity are, it goes back to what many countries are framing now as energy security and food security, so lots of opportunities as it would relate to our minerals in particular, with the electrification, energy and of course our agricultural commodities for food.

    There are a lot more opportunities with respect to our manufacturing and, indeed, our data industries that you could find with quantum computing or AI. Of course, that's different by region and by country, but there are many opportunities.

    You have 26 seconds.

    What type of energy are you talking about?

    Yes, absolutely. Energy refers to oil, gas and other forms, biofuels, etc.

    Thank you very much.

    We move on to Mr. Sidhu for six minutes, please.

     Thank you, Madam Chair.

     Thanks to our witnesses for taking the time to join us here today.

    I want to say thank you to EDC and, of course, all the trade commissioners across the world and here in Canada. They do exceptional work on the ground. I've seen this first-hand.

    I want to give Ms. Wilshaw a chance to highlight some of the services that the trade commissioner service provides to businesses, both here in Canada and across our network abroad.

    The trade commissioner service helps exporters reach foreign markets to sell products and services. We aim to provide clients with practical advice and intelligence on foreign markets to help them make better business decisions. The trade commissioner clients are Canadian companies that have meaningful economic ties to Canada and are looking to grow their businesses through exports.

    We offer four key services in all the posts we have, and I mentioned 150 locations around the world: We assess market potential; we develop market entry strategies along with the clients; we provide qualified lists of contacts and put them in touch with business opportunities; and we solve problems. That's a big category. A lot of those are big categories.

    What we do is sit down with our clients and talk to them about how they would like to enter the international marketplace, what their preferred method is and where they would like to go. Then we also try to present business opportunities to them that we have heard about from particular markets, talk about whether those are a good fit for their business, put them together with key players in the different markets and hope that something succeeds out of that. We're pretty good at it these days.

    Definitely. There are some great stories and progress in terms of helping businesses expand into new markets around the world.

     Within our Indo-Pacific strategy, a $2.3-billion strategy that we launched last year, we committed to team Canada trade missions. You highlighted some of the trade missions that Minister Ng has been doing, the most recent being in Japan.

    Can you speak about some of the successes from that trade mission and the impacts it's had on the ground?

    Yes, I'm happy to speak about that, Madam Chair.

    In that mission, we had a pretty significant delegation of businesses. We engaged in a lot of outreach, as well, prior to that. The team on the ground tried to set it up as best they could for the inbound businesses. Then we arranged a lot of business-to-business meetings and opportunities for the companies that were participating. They sat down with local contacts who may have opportunities for them. We've already seen some results. Some non-disclosure agreements have been signed and some deals are being pursued. We're pretty excited about the prospects.

    We'll continue to follow up with the companies that participated in that. Of course, the team in Japan is continuing to work with the local contacts, as well.

    Thank you.

    I understand that, in 2018, the trade commissioner service created a team to help Canadian businesses harness the impacts of Canada's free trade agreements. As you may be aware, this government has signed a record number of trade agreements, unlocking markets around the world and billions of consumers for Canadian businesses to access.

    Could you speak more about this work that the TCS team is doing?

    I'm happy to, Madam Chair.

    What we saw at the beginning—it's the reason why we entered into promoting the use of free trade agreements—is that we spent all that time negotiating free trade agreements, but there was a somewhat lower rate of utilization than we like seeing. People were effectively leaving money on the table, if you will. Maybe that was because they didn't know how to access the agreements or how the agreements could help them.

    We decided it would be useful to spend some time and energy to do some more work to make it easier. Since then, we've put out a number of videos, vignettes, tools and training to help people access and understand the free trade agreements. We have seen the utilization rates increase. We are seeing the FTAs being used.

    We're also using the FTA data to up our own game. If somebody comes to us and says they're interested in exporting something to France, we might be able to say there's another market that is perhaps better suited for them and where they would have a better advantage, given the FTAs we have in place.

     Thank you for that.

    I'll turn to Ms. Lavery.

    Thank you so much for being here today.

    Part of my role, before politics, for 13 years as an international trade consultant, was making sure that businesses knew how to utilize these trade agreements. Within our Indo-Pacific strategy, we've announced an agriculture and agri-food office opening in Manila, Philippines.

    Could you speak to how that would be a benefit to some of your clients?

    Absolutely, Madam Chair.

    There are a few things that are very interesting to Canadian exporters. One is the presence on the ground, which gives them the visibility and the understanding of how business is done in those markets. The trade commissioner is a very important presence on the ground. Indeed, it's why we want to be there. That's together with the opportunity to identify companies that need specific support in the market itself and help them grow their presence in the region.

    Specifically on agriculture, there is such a demand currently in the Indo-Pacific region and in the ASEAN region in particular, as many countries focus on food security. Anything we can do to make it easier to actually import into those countries—particularly agricultural products, because they generally have more regulations associated with them from a health and safety perspective—is incredibly important.

    Again, it's about the ease of getting products to the market with the credibility that comes attached to that with the Canadian brand. Having our presence in those countries allows us to work with local authorities, local regulators and local companies to encourage them to import more from Canada.

    Recent studies have shown that some of the growth opportunities are in those markets in Vietnam, Bangladesh and other countries that have different standards than Canada. We need to be ready to help our exporters get the products into those markets.

    Thank you very much.

    We'll go on to Mr. Savard-Tremblay for six minutes, please.

    Thank you, Madam Chair.

    I would like to greet my colleagues once again, as we gather back together after a month.

    I also want to thank the witnesses for being here and for their presentations.

    My first question is for the Department of Foreign Affairs, Trade and Development officials, but I'll ask the Export Development Canada officials to respond as well.

    We know that a number of countries are bankrupt and that some are autocracies or authoritarian regimes. How can we ensure government transparency with regard to supplies in these countries, or in countries that, for example, have poor working conditions?

    Thanks for the question, Madam Chair. It gives me an opportunity to speak about responsible business conduct. I think that is the key element here. We're talking about the expectations we have of the Canadian companies when they're operating abroad. We expect Canadian companies to abide by all relevant laws, to respect human rights and to adopt best practices and international guidelines on responsible business conduct.

    My organization, the trade commissioner service, provides advice to clients on how to mitigate risks in some of the conditions that the member was describing, to strengthen their responsible business conduct practices. We try to use that to make the companies more resilient by enhancing awareness of production and supply chain risks, as well as operational, financial and legal risks.

    We also see it as a competitive advantage for Canada. If our companies are out there doing the right things around the world and are known to be responsible actors in the global marketplace, we believe that increases the brand value and customer retention. We see that as a positive for the Canadian economy.

    Before asking the Export Development Canada officials to respond, I'd like to clarify something.

    You said that you expect responsible business conduct. However, in addition to these expectations, is there any checking involved?

    Can you tell us more about the current mechanisms?

    Madam Chair, I'm happy to talk about how we handle allegations of misconduct.

    When an allegation of misconduct is presented to us, when we hear about this, there are a number of different ways in which we can treat that. We start by reinforcing our expectations of the client, obviously. Then we have and can offer good offices under a couple of different avenues. There's the national contact point, which is established under the OECD guidelines for multinational enterprises. There is also a mechanism for the CORE, which is the Canadian ombudsperson for responsible enterprise, to have dialogues.

    Actually, there are some legal mechanisms in place as well. There are several legal avenues, such as the Corruption of Foreign Public Officials Act, which is a process we have for alerting the RCMP. Then there are other legal avenues, such as the Extractive Sector Transparency Measures Act and the customs tariff, which makes it illegal to import products made with forced labour.

    Those are a couple of different tools that exist.

     Madam Chair, I'll provide the answer for EDC.

    It really starts with talking to the companies and ensuring they understand that the items you referenced can actually impact their long-term sustainability. It starts with the education of our Canadian companies and providing them the tools so they can understand the risks they might be getting into, whether that is providing them information on how to consider forced labour or child labour in supply chains, or giving them the tools to assess that. That's incredibly important. It starts with really trying to build up their knowledge and understanding.

    When it comes to being in receipt of EDC support and asking EDC to participate, that triggers all of the due diligence where we consider risk factors that include the sector of operation and the country of operation, or where the buyer might be located, as well as the product itself.

    We do quite an extensive set of due diligence that focuses on the environment and human rights. Again, some of the examples are forced labour or the impact on local communities, as well as financial crimes and all they entail. It's a very comprehensive due diligence based on risk factors that we might see, so that we can then go and investigate deeper if we see any of those risk indicators in place.

     It would be good to hear the officials from both departments respond if there's time.

    As we know, a bill was promised before the end of the year to eradicate forced labour from supply chains. This didn't happen. Our committee voted unanimously to remind the government of its commitment in this area.

    Are there any comprehensive mechanisms of this kind? If so, why is a bill still needed? Have you heard that this will be done soon?

    I'm not sure if you're referring to Bill S-211, which came into.... You're talking about perhaps some legislation that ESDC was asked to bring forward.

    This commitment was set out in the 2023 budget, which stated that a bill of this nature would be created before the end of the year.

    I know what you are referring to. Budget 2023 announced a commitment by the government to introduce legislation in 2024 to eradicate forced labour from supply chains. I think that's what you're referring to.

    Employment and Social Development Canada is the lead on labour issues. It has the primary responsibility for this. It works closely with stakeholders and international partners to ensure a strengthened approach to tackling forced and child labour.

    Minister Ng has, in her mandate letter, commitments to support ESDC in coming forward and developing this legislation. Our teams are working together to do that.

    Next, we have Mr. Cannings for six minutes, please.

    Thank you.

    I'd like to follow along the same line of questioning as Mr. Savard-Tremblay.

    We had a study in this committee a year or so ago about the responsible conduct of Canadian enterprises abroad. We had the minister, I believe, but we also had the ombudsperson for responsible enterprise here. One thing she clearly said, when she was here.... We were talking about our Canadian reputation abroad, which really affects our ability to export and import. When we asked how many cases she was working on, it was very few. The reason she gave was that nobody was bringing cases to the CORE, because it doesn't have powers. It doesn't have powers to bring in witnesses. It doesn't have powers to get documents, so the people interested in bringing these cases forward would go elsewhere. They would go to the UN or whatever.

    Have you heard of any pressure from within government to give the ombudsperson those powers, so she can do the job that we all expect her to do and that she wants to do?

    I do recall that study from this committee, and, of course, we paid close attention to it at the time. As you know, the CORE was appointed in 2019. Part of the early days of that office was setting up the procedures and so on. That may be part of the reason why perhaps there weren't many cases in the early days.

    As I understand it, and it's public knowledge, the cases are always posted quarterly on the CORE's website. There are currently 21 active cases: five in the intake phase, six in an initial assessment, nine under investigation, and one where recommendations have been made to the company. I've spoken with the office of the CORE recently, and my understanding is that members of the group are very busy these days and are seeing some relatively good success with their efforts.

     I'm heartened to hear that, because I believe they'd been going for four years when we talked to them and had literally a handful of cases. The reason given was this lack of powers. I'm hoping those powers are still coming, because I think it's so important for Canada's reputation abroad.

    Now, to completely change gears and talk more about what you can do to help Canadian companies.... I know you're outward-facing, so I'm trying to find examples.

    I have a riding with six small border crossings, so a lot of the companies in my riding do business with the United States, especially. I'm wondering what supports you provide to them. Hopefully, some of them will be here, testifying. I have a small graphite mine that produces the best graphite you can imagine but has difficulties exporting it because it faces competition from Chinese companies in Mozambique, for instance.

    I'm just wondering what kind of help you provide to those companies.

    I'm really grateful for the question.

    The border cities and communities are incredibly important in this trade space. As you say, folks travel back and forth all the time.

     I was posted in the United States, so I understand that market fairly well and how we work. I can tell you that across the U.S. last year, we served almost 3,000 clients and delivered over 8,000 services to them, and we saw more than a hundred successes.

    As I said earlier, what we try to do is sit down and understand the client's needs and concerns. Whatever the product or service is that they're looking to export, we try to find them the right kinds of tools and supports to help them go internationally, whether that's referring them to our friends at EDC or some other organization that can give them that support, or advising them on local market conditions if we're concerned with risks, as Monsieur Savard-Tremblay mentioned, in certain jurisdictions. We really try to de-risk their approach to those markets by offering them tools, supports, alternatives, contacts and opportunities as they come to us, as well, from all the folks we have on the ground around the world.

    Did you want to add something, Ms. Lavery?

    Be quick. You have 26 seconds remaining.

    I think it's really important to address your point about the competition.

    One of the things at EDC that we're very clear about is working with other ECAs and with the Department of Finance at the OECD level to ensure that there is a level playing field for our Canadian companies. That's particularly true in the financing space, which EDC would be more involved with, to ensure that our exporters have access to the same rates, the same tenors and the ability to get financing for their activities.

    Thank you very much.

    Mr. Seeback, you have five minutes, please.

    Thanks very much, Madam Chair.

    Mr. Sidhu brought up the Indo-Pacific strategy, so I thought I would ask a couple of questions related to that.

    It was launched in November 2022. In March 2023, Professor Hugh Stephens wrote an article, saying:

    It's almost a year later. I want to talk about some of these things that have been announced.

    The Indo-Pacific agriculture and agri-food office component of market diversification is $31.8 million over five years. What's the status of that? How much money has been spent? How many people have been hired?

    I believe the head of that office has been put in place. I spoke to her the other day, but this is an Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada responsibility and lead, so it will be rolling out that office and getting it set up.

    To the best of your knowledge, it's one person so far.

    I don't know, in fact, if there are more people on—

    You know of only one person.

     At the moment, I know who the head of the office is.

    Eighteen months later, after the strategy was launched, one person has been hired. That's an impressive rate.

    Let's look at something else here.

    The Canadian trade gateway in Southeast Asia has involved $24.1 million over five years. What's the status of that? How many people have been hired? How much money has been spent and what's the spend over the next 3.5 years? We're a year and a half in.

    Madam Chair, I can say that there is work on developing what the gateway will look like and how it will serve outside of the trade commissioner service, because obviously we do not want to duplicate the services that already exist. We are talking to folks who are interested in getting into the market about what will help them and what will be most useful for them in terms of getting on the ground there. Again, this is the responsibility of others who are working towards that goal.

    It sounds to me like, 18 months into the Indo-Pacific strategy and the Canadian trade gateway in Southeast Asia, we're just talking about doing some things. Is that an accurate assessment? Nothing's been set up. No one's been hired. No money has been spent.

    I believe it's still in the development phase.

    Thanks very much.

    There's the expansion of natural resource ties with the Indo-Pacific region, for $13.5 million over five years. Does anyone have any idea what the status of that is 18 months after the launch of the strategy?

    Madam Chair, NRCan is leading that. I wouldn't be able to speak to that.

    What's the status of the agricultural office? Mr. Sidhu brought that up. You said that one person has been appointed. Is that what we talked about before? Was that the same envelope of funding?

    Madam Chair, I'm not an expert on what AAFC's process is or on whether there were different envelopes they were accessing. I do know that the head of that office is in place. I do not know the status of the rest of her office and whether she in fact has other people there or not. AAFC is leading that.

    One of the key partners in the Indo-Pacific is Japan. I understand you have spent some time in Japan. Would you say that LNG is something that Japan has been asking for from Canada?

    I think it's very clear that they're involved and interested in accessing LNG.

    That's LNG specifically from Canada. They've asked Canada for LNG. Is that correct?

    They've made some investments in LNG in Canada.

    What's the current government's position? Are you aware of whether or not the government plans to export any LNG to Japan?

    I'm not in a position to say that.

    You have 24 seconds remaining, Mr. Seeback.

    Okay. Thank you very much.

    Those are all of my questions. Thank you, Madam Chair.

    Mr. Arya, go ahead for five minutes, please.

    Thank you, Madam Chair.

    Welcome to the committee, Ms. Wilshaw.

    Whenever I travel abroad, I go to Canadian embassies and high commissions, and I always make a point of meeting the trade commissioners. In my view, they have the most important positions in any Canadian mission.

    Our trade with the U.S. is so big, but finding information on the trade commissioner service outside of the North American market is very difficult. It's very difficult for me to say how good, bad or great it is outside of North America. It's very difficult to access that information.

    I would like just a quick clarification before I go in. You mentioned that one person has been appointed under the Indo-Pacific strategy office that has been set up, but you actually don't know how many people have been employed. You can't know that for sure, so it is plausible that others have also been employed, but you may not be aware of it.

    That is correct. It is with Agriculture Canada.

    Now, were you part of the June 2022 Canada-U.S. supply chains progress report?

    No, sir. That is not a part of my—

    Okay. I had questions about that, because we are dealing with the supply chain.

    Are you aware of any reports on the items that are considered to be critical or essential under the supply chain scenario, if a pandemic hits again?

     Madam Chair, I think that would fall to Public Services and Procurement Canada and also to ISED. They look at critical...and vulnerabilities in our supply chain.

    Thank you.

     Coming back to the trade commissioner service, you mentioned—and I'm glad to know this—that ICT is one of your biggest customer bases or fields, but outside of North America, who are the top three biggest customers?

    Madam Chair, the top outcomes I can speak to for the trade commissioner service by region are actually.... The Indo-Pacific is the number one region for outcomes of the services that we in the trade commissioner service provide to Canadian clients. After that, it is the U.S. and Mexico, and then Europe.

    My question was what percentage of Canadian companies.... What are the top sectors within Canada that are looking to export outside of North America?

     Oh, I see. I'm sorry. I didn't understand the question, Madam Chair.

     They're the same areas, as a matter of fact. The same sectors are the key sectors that we see, although, as I think Ms. Lavery mentioned, it does depend a little bit on the market. It would be hard to paint everything with a single brush.

     In any case, the export outside of North America is so small that even when we segregate....

    Coming back to, again, outside of North America, I know that Canadian agriculture produce and agri-food products are the stars that make Canada the fifth-largest exporter in the world. Whenever we sign any trade agreement—and we have signed many—I notice, as a member of the international trade committee, that this sector aggressively goes after and tries to expand its markets, its exports. I have not been seeing that from other major sectors in Canada. Take the steel and aluminum sector, for example. More than 90% of its exports are just to North America, other than the domestic market in Canada.

    What can we do to motivate sectors like steel and aluminum to go after the new markets when we sign free trade agreements?

    Madam Chair, I think this is a very good, important question—to try to motivate people beyond the North American space. Obviously, that is where a lot of our clients want to start, because it's an understandable market, a large market and a wealthy market, and there are a number of opportunities for Canadian businesses there.

    We try to encourage people to go not just to the United States but beyond. Obviously, the U.S. is a big one. We do try. We offer different services that help to de-risk that. As I mentioned, we have CanExport as well, which helps to do some co-funding, matching funding for people to explore new markets. As I mentioned with the free trade agreements, we also try to put the information in front of clients to help them understand how to use the free trade agreements and what the benefits are. We've gone and negotiated all of these, and we'd really like our clients to take advantage of them. We are seeing a strong utilization of those.

    I think a lot of it comes down to education. We work with a lot of partners all across the country—provinces and territories, as well as federal government partners, municipal partners and our Crowns—to put on webinars and all kinds of educational opportunities to help people understand how to use the FTAs and understand what the opportunities are for them around the world, and to try to encourage them to go as far afield as they possibly can.

    These are some of the ways—it's not comprehensive; the trade missions are another way—in which we try to get people to explore new markets out there and show them that it's okay, that they can go farther than the U.S.

    Thank you very much.

    Now we'll move on to Mr. Savard-Tremblay for two and a half minutes, please.

    Thank you, Madam Chair.

    If you don't mind, I would like to talk about fall 2018. The government's economic statement announced the export diversification strategy. The goal was a 50% increase in Canada's exports by 2025. It's now 2024. In 11 months, we can take stock of that announcement. As part of this strategy, the government announced an investment of $1.1 billion over six years, starting in 2018‑19, to help Canadian businesses access new foreign markets.

    First, have the investments been made?

     Yes, I'm happy to say, Madam Chair, that we did receive and launch a whole strategy toward trade diversification back in 2018. We've been rolling that out, and we are fully staffed up, with some additional resources that we received to support Canadian business around the world through different mechanisms.

    We are, I'm very happy to say, on track to achieving that 50% increase in trade with markets beyond the United States. Last year, goods and service trade hit a record high of $1.9 trillion, and that is on track.

     You're confirming that the investment of $1.1 billion over six years has been made. You're also confirming that exports will increase by 50% by the end of this year. Is that right?

    Just to clarify, I think it is by 2025, yes.

    Yes, exactly. Since it's 2024, it will be by the end of this year.

    Can you confirm the information concerning both the investment and export growth?

    Yes, sir, I believe that's where we are at.

    Thank you.

    You have 30 seconds remaining. Are you good? Okay.

    We will move on to Mr. Cannings for two and a half minutes.

    I'd just like to turn to Ms. Lavery to talk about EDC and supports for businesses. I think of EDC as an organization that supports big business—pipelines, etc.—with big help. Where is the lower end of that?

    As I was saying before, most of the businesses in my riding doing export business to the United States, primarily, are small businesses. I have a company, for instance, that happens to be the biggest lead-acid battery recycler in western North America. It wants to expand that, because competitors in the States have fallen by the wayside. They needed a small amount of money to make those expansions. I'm just wondering where you fit into that, and where BDC fits into that, or where they should turn for help like that.

    Thank you for the question. I'm really excited, actually, by this question.

    I think that at EDC there was a perception over a number of years, because we kept talking about EDC and the products that it provides. We provide insurance to help make sure people get paid for the exports they make. We also provide financing and capital to actually help the companies.

    However, we really have been expanding in the last five years, and one of the most-used products, by 80% of our small business users—because 80% of our customers are small and medium-sized businesses—is our knowledge products. How do they get into markets? We work very closely with the trade commissioner service on providing them tools, guidance and advice on how they export.

    BDC has a different mandate, because it's the bank of entrepreneurs; we're very focused on just the exporters. However, we changed our whole organization to actually be structured by small companies, medium-sized companies and large, so that the whole of the EDC team is focused on meeting the needs, which are very different for small companies versus medium, versus large.

    With our small companies, we find that products that include our guarantees with their local bank, where we guarantee the working capital for exports, as well as our credit insurance products, are really well used by those companies, because they provide working capital for them, versus very large companies that need a different financial solution.

    We've really tried to focus on making sure we understand the needs. We do lots of surveys. We do lots of promoter score surveys as well as checkpoints with them, to make sure we're truly meeting their needs.

    I think that, in the small and micro space, it tends to be that they need help to actually build the capability within the company. Often, even some of the questions we ask them help build their understanding of what they will need to do when they go to exports. We're very focused on meeting the needs by different segments.

    Thank you very much.

    Mr. Baldinelli, you have five minutes, please.

    Thank you, Madam Chair.

    Thank you to the witnesses for being with us this afternoon.

    I just want to build on some of the comments of my colleague here, who was talking about the Indo-Pacific strategy. There was also a commitment within that for trade missions abroad. It indicated about $100 million over five years to be committed to that.

    As we're two years in already, I was just wondering, Ms. Wilshaw, if you could provide an update on that.

     Yes, Madam Chair, I'm very happy to.

    The team Canada trade missions are well under way. We run trade missions regularly. We did two last year outside of the Indo-Pacific—we went to Chile and to the United Kingdom—but in terms of the Indo-Pacific—

     I'll just stop you there. That's my error, and I apologize for that.

    I'm just looking at the Indo-Pacific regional capacity uplift, which is $100 million over five years. Trade missions are a different fund. I was just wondering where we stand on that two years in.

    Do you mean where we stand on the capacity uplift?

    Yes, I'm wondering about new positions to significantly expand capacities at Canada's missions abroad and in Canada with a goal of advancing and defending Canadian interests in the Indo-Pacific.

    Yes, sir, I'm aware of the commitment. It is being run by the geographic branch, which is a different part of Global Affairs Canada. That said, I can say that some of the positions, particularly those that have to do with supporting clean tech, are under creation. There is a process to go through to develop the positions, to get them approved, to put them in place and then to hire staff, so we have been in the process of engaging those folks for those positions and getting them in place.

    Do you have a head count, for example, that you could provide us as to how much has been spent to date, two years in?

    I do not. We could come back to you with that.

    If you could share that information, that would be great.

    I'll just go further in some of the services that are provided by the trade commissioners' offices. You see, for example, the CanExport innovation program, which helps small and medium-sized firms, academic institutions and non-governmental research centres in Canada to commercialize their technologies. It talks about programs that help pursue collective research and developments projects with foreign partners, for example.

    Are there any rules in place with regard to the protection of IP that is created through some of the funding that's provided by the federal government for this?

    Madam Chair, as a matter of fact, there was a separate budget decision that allocated additional funding to CanExport specifically to support IP protection in international markets. The team has been marketing that. We market our services to try to get more companies to access that funding to help them make sure they know what the risks are and make sure they are utilizing all of the government's supports and services in trying to protect their IP.

    In addition to that, if I may, Madam Chair, we have dedicated staff who help advise on IP risks in certain key, high-risk markets.

    That's excellent.

    Now, would that same rule apply to the Canadian international innovation program as well?

    The Canadian international innovation program is designed to support co-innovation between partner countries. We have science, tech and innovation agreements with, I think, 15 different partners. Each comes to the table with a certain amount of money, and we support research and development for the purposes of co-innovation and commercialization of new technologies. That funding is designed to support those kinds of activities.

    I have one quick question, being in a border community myself, my home community. Mr. Cannings talked about the notion.... I think my colleague talked about it earlier as well, and you mentioned it. It's about the whole educational component in letting those small and medium-sized enterprises know of your services and how they can come forward and make use of your services.

    I think that's one of the biggest detriments. They simply don't know that the government has opportunities to assist. Could you just provide some examples of what you do to share your information out there with the community?

    I'm very happy to start, or did you mean to address that to Mairead?

    I'll start with EDC.

    Thank you.

    One of the biggest forums is webinars and, of course, the website, because everybody wants digital, and they want to access the resources 24-7. We've been structured to make those resources available to people when they need them. Just last week, we had a webinar with over 2,000 people on how to get started on exporting. For the first time, we co-promoted that with the trade commissioner service, with many of the different team Canada trade missions, and it had a huge impact.

     I see the chair waving at me.

     Well, I'm just trying to complete the round.

    Mr. Sheehan has the last five minutes.

    Thank you.

    Thank you, Madam Chair.

    Thank you very much for your presentations and your work on this very important file.

    I'm co-chair of the Canada-Japan interparliamentary group. I've had the opportunity to speak with some of the Japanese parliamentarians. They were here in Ottawa in August. There were people here such as the ambassador. They are very high on the Indo-Pacific strategy. They really are. There are other countries that are, as well. There's so much opportunity.

     As part of the Indo-Pacific strategy, there's a process for trying to promote peace and security in the area. In particular, there are some joint exercises with the military. You have Russia. Japan and Canada have put sanctions on Russia, which is now running exercises in what they call the Northern Territories. You have China in the South China Sea and East China Sea. There are a lot of challenges, but we need to secure that.

    In securing that, Japan has also realized the opportunities between Canada and Japan. It's just the Pacific Ocean. It's free and clear. They are very hungry right now to do more. They are the largest direct investor from Asia. You've seen Honda now exploring EV batteries again, probably in Ontario. Who knows?

    I would like you to make some comments on the opportunities in the region, in particular for the businesses over here. I will suggest to you that it's very well known over there. What are we doing to promote the Indo-Pacific strategy to our businesses and collaborators—the Canadian ones—to realize the opportunities that are there?

    Thanks for the question on this.

    Japan occupies a very special place in my heart. It was my first posting, and I have very fond memories. I can see a lot of change, as a matter of fact, in how the relationship has progressed over the years, which is quite exciting.

    In terms of how you bring those opportunities in front of Canadians, I think Ms. Lavery was talking about the webinars. We do specific webinars on countries. We do them on specific sectors, as well, within those countries. We try to put our information out there as broadly as we can. Running the trade missions is a great way for folks to experiment and explore those areas.

    Trade missions aren't the only events we run. I'm not going to get the number right, but we have several hundred trade commissioners in the Indo-Pacific area. They are all across the region. Every day, they are out there speaking to local businesses to understand their needs and interests. They feed those back into our offices across Canada. They use that in our databases to find Canadians who might be able to respond to those opportunities. We call them up and talk to them. We present the opportunity. We help them understand how we can de-risk it through partnerships and other supports, and by giving them the right contacts and putting those pieces together for them. We try to do that as much as possible.

    Going back to the last question, which was about how we get to the very small businesses—93% of our clients are small and medium-sized businesses—we also use, at a very general level, search engine optimization and other tools like that. When you type “Canada” and “export”, you get the trade commissioner service and EDC. They come right up at the very top of the search. We try to make it as easy as possible for folks to find us.

    We recognize that we need to keep going out into the regions. That is why we have offices all across the country to do that. They maintain the linkages and work with our partners in the provinces, territories and municipalities to try to make it not hard to find us.

    I would like to add to that.

    Once the companies in Japan know about Canada and are willing to invest in Canada, we have to broaden that. We have to help Canadian companies get into their supply chains. We have to make more Japanese companies interested in what Canadian capabilities look like. That's a very important matching activity that both the trade commissioner service and EDC do. Us going in and understanding the needs within Japanese companies and how Canadian companies can support these is a much more aggressive strategy than just waiting for them to come. We have to get in there.

    At EDC, we have a couple of programs. There's a market leader program, where we try to engage with some of the leading companies in these markets to subsequently introduce Canadian companies to them. We also need to work with the Japanese companies—you chose Japan—that are present in Canada. How do we introduce them to the supply chain that exists in Canada so that, globally, the company then starts talking about the talent and resources in Canada?

    There isn't one silver bullet. We have to go at this from every angle. We have to make sure that everyone knows what Canadian companies can do.

     Thank you.

    Thank you very much to our witnesses, and apologies for the delay. Thank you for the invaluable information you've given us today.

    Again, our apologies to the second panel, but we'll look forward to seeing you at the next opportunity we have.

    Thanks again to all of you.

    The meeting is adjourned.