Financial Procedures / Legislation

May 25, 1999

Debates, p. 15293

On May 25, 1995, during the debate on the motion for the third reading of Bill C-78, An Act to establish the Public Sector Pension Investment Board, to amend the Public Service Superannuation Act, the Canadian Forces Superannuation Act, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police Superannuation Act, the Defence Services Pension Continuation Act, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police Pension Continuation Act, the members of Parliament Retiring Allowances Act and the Canada Post Corporation Act and to make a consequential amendment to another Act, John Williams (St. Albert) rose on a point of order to challenge the procedural validity of the bill since it was not accompanied by a ways and means motion. Mr. Williams argued that since the bill empowers the government to deposit into the Consolidated Revenue Fund pension surpluses from contributions or investments, it could therefore affect any Canadian citizen as a potential employee of the government and it should be treated as a charge upon the people. The Acting Speaker (Ian McClelland) indicated that a ruling would be made shortly.^[1]

Prior to the vote on the bill, the Speaker delivered his ruling. He ruled that Bill C-78 would not affect the Canadian public in general but a “defined and limited group of people”. A ways and means motion was necessary when money raised by imposition was used either for public benefit or for purposes otherwise financed from the Consolidated Revenue Fund. In this case, a ways and means motion was not necessary; the bill was properly before the House.

Decision of the Chair

The Speaker: I am now ready to rule on the point of order raised by the honourable member for St. Albert concerning the procedural acceptability of Bill C-78, An Act to establish the Public Sector Pension Investment Board, to amend the Public Service Superannuation Act, the Canadian Forces Superannuation Act, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police Superannuation Act, the Defence Services Pension Continuation Act, the Royal Canadian Mounted Police Pension Continuation Act, the members of Parliament Retiring Allowances Act and the Canada Post Corporation Act and to make a consequential amendment to another Act.

The honourable member contends that Bill C-78 imposes a “charge upon the people” in that it proposes to make any of these pension plan surpluses payable to the Consolidated Revenue Fund. This, he argues, constitutes a form of tax which would require the bill to be preceded by a ways and means motion.

In the time available to me I have carefully reviewed the remarks made by the honourable member and I have noted that he makes no mention of the fact that any shortfalls in these plans accrue as a liability to the Government of Canada.

Under the heading of “Matters requiring authorization by Ways and Means”, May in the 22nd edition at page 777 states in part:

If—money raised by statutory imposition—is—to be used for the benefit of the public at large or for purposes which might otherwise have required to be financed from the Consolidated Fund, that imposition is likely to need authorization by a ways and means resolution.

However, as the honourable Minister of Public Works and Government Services has pointed out, the legislation affects not the Canadian public in general but “a defined and limited group of people” who, as co-contributors, will be entitled to a defined benefit.

Consequently I cannot agree with the honourable member for St. Albert. I rule that Bill C-78 is properly before the House and we will proceed with the vote on third reading.

P0613-e

36-1

1999-05-25