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ETHI Committee Meeting

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Minutes of Proceedings

43rd Parliament, 2nd Session
Meeting 32
Friday, April 23, 2021, 1:05 p.m. to 12:53 p.m.
In Camera
Presiding
Chris Warkentin, Chair (Conservative)

Library of Parliament
• Alexandra Savoie, Analyst
• Ryan van den Berg, Analyst
• Maxime-Olivier Thibodeau, Analyst
 
House of Commons
• Erica Pereira, Procedural Clerk
The committee proceeded to the consideration of matters related to committee business.

It was agreed, — That, in relation to its study on the Main Estimates 2021-22, the committee invite the Privacy Commissioner, the Information Commissioner, the Lobbying Commissioner and the Ethics Commissioner to appear at a time determined by the Chair, for one hour each.

It was agreed, — That, in relation to its study on the use and impact of facial recognition technology, the Privacy Commissioner be invited for one hour following his appearance on the Main Estimates 2021-22.

The motion, “That the Committee proceed to resuming debate on the motion of Brenda Shanahan moved on Monday, April 19, 2021” was moved.

The question was put on the motion and the result of the vote was announced:

YEAS: Han Dong, Greg Fergus, Patricia Lattanzio, Brenda Shanahan, Francesco Sorbara — 5;

NAYS: Taylor Bachrach, Michael Barrett, Colin Carrie, Rhéal Éloi Fortin, Jacques Gourde — 5.

Whereupon, the Chair voted in the negative.

Accordingly, the motion was negatived.

The motion, “That, in furtherance of the study of the protection of privacy and reputation on platforms such as Pornhub, the committee produce an interim report on the protection of privacy and reputation on platforms such as Pornhub; and that the committee hear further witnesses, with regard to the privacy and reputation concerns related to non-consensual images shared on the web, for no less than four hours.” was moved.

Debate arose thereon.

At 1:50 p.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 1:56 p.m., the sitting resumed.

The motion, “that debate on the motion be now adjourned” was moved.

The question was put on the motion and the result of the vote was announced:

YEAS: Taylor Bachrach, Michael Barrett, Colin Carrie, Rhéal Éloi Fortin, Jacques Gourde — 5;

NAYS: Han Dong, Greg Fergus, Patricia Lattanzio, Brenda Shanahan, Francesco Sorbara — 5.

Whereupon, the Chair voted in the affirmative.

Accordingly, the motion was agreed to.

The motion “That the committee resume debate on the motion moved by Rhéal Éloi Fortin on Thursday, April 8, 2021” was moved.

At 2:00 p.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 2:05 p.m., the sitting resumed.

The question was put on the motion and the result of the vote was announced:

YEAS: Taylor Bachrach, Michael Barrett, Colin Carrie, Rhéal Éloi Fortin, Jacques Gourde — 5;

NAYS: Han Dong, Greg Fergus, Patricia Lattanzio, Brenda Shanahan, Francesco Sorbara — 5.

Whereupon, the Chair voted in the affirmative.

Accordingly, the motion was agreed to.

At 2:10 p.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 2:12 p.m., the sitting resumed.

The motion, “That the committee sit in public” was moved.

The question was put on the motion and the result of the vote was announced:

YEAS: Taylor Bachrach, Michael Barrett, Colin Carrie, Rhéal Éloi Fortin, Jacques Gourde — 5;

NAYS: Han Dong, Greg Fergus, Patricia Lattanzio, Brenda Shanahan, Francesco Sorbara — 5.

Whereupon, the Chair voted in the affirmative.

Accordingly, the motion was agreed to.

At 2:16 p.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 2:21 p.m., the sitting resumed in public.

The committee resumed consideration of the motion moved by Rhéal Éloi Fortin on Thursday, April 8, 2021 as follows:

That, pursuant to the motion adopted by the House of Commons on Thursday, March 25, 2021:

  1. The committee met on:

    a. Monday, March 29, 2021, at 2:00 p.m., to hear witness Rick Theis;

    b. Wednesday, March 31, 2021, at 2:00 p.m., to hear witness Amitpal Singh; and

    c. Thursday, April 8, 2021, at 2:00 p.m., to hear witness Ben Chin.

  2. The committee noted the absence of these witnesses, who had been called to appear before the committee pursuant to the order in the motion adopted by the House on Thursday, March 25, 2021;
  3. The committee confirms that it has not released these witnesses from their obligation to appear;
  4. The committee also noted the absence of the Prime Minister, who was given the option of appearing in place of these witnesses in the motion of Thursday, March 25, 2021;
  5. The committee noted that Minister Pablo Rodriguez appeared on Monday, March 29, 2021, instead of Rick Theis, after having ordered him not to appear before the committee, as mentioned in his letter to the Chair received by committee members on Sunday, March 28, 2021; and
  6. The committee noted that Minister Mona Fortier also ordered witnesses Amitpal Singh and Ben Chin not to appear before the committee, as mentioned in her letters to the Chair dated Tuesday, March 30, 2021, and Wednesday, April 7, 2021.

That the committee report these events to the House of Commons in order to express its dissatisfaction.

Debate arose thereon.

Motion

Taylor Bachrach moved, — That the committee do now suspend.

The question was put on the motion and it was agreed to on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Taylor Bachrach, Michael Barrett, Colin Carrie, Han Dong, Greg Fergus, Rhéal Éloi Fortin, Jacques Gourde, Patricia Lattanzio, Brenda Shanahan, Francesco Sorbara — 10;

NAYS: — 0.

At 3:10 p.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 11:03 a.m., on Monday, April 26, 2021, the sitting resumed in Room 025-B, West Block.

The committee resumed consideration on the motion moved by Rhéal Éloi Fortin of Thursday, April 8, 2021.

Debate arose thereon.

Motion

Patricia Lattanzio moved, — That the debate be now adjourned.

The question was put on the motion and the result of the vote was announced:

YEAS: Han Dong, Greg Fergus, Patricia Lattanzio, Brenda Shanahan, Francesco Sorbara — 5;

NAYS: Michael Barrett, Colin Carrie, Rhéal Éloi Fortin, Jacques Gourde, Gord Johns — 5.

Whereupon, the Chair voted in the negative.

Accordingly, the motion was negatived.

The committee resumed consideration of the motion moved by Rhéal Éloi Fortin on Thursday, April 8, 2021.

Debate arose thereon.

Motion

Michael Barrett moved, — That the meeting be now suspended.

The question was put on the motion and it was agreed to on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Michael Barrett, Colin Carrie, Han Dong, Greg Fergus, Rhéal Éloi Fortin, Jacques Gourde, Patricia Lattanzio, Brenda Shanahan, Francesco Sorbara — 9;

NAYS: Charlie Angus — 1.

At 1:10 p.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 1:01 p.m., on Friday, April 30, 2021, the sitting resumed in Room 035-B, West Block.

The committee resumed consideration of the motion moved by Rheal Éloi Fortin on Thursday, April 8, 2021, which read as follows :

That, pursuant to the motion adopted by the House on Thursday, March 25, 2021:

  1. The committee met on:

    a. Monday, March 29, 2021, at 2:00 p.m. to hear witness Rick Theis;

    b. Wednesday, March 31, 2021, at 2:00 p.m. to hear witness Amitpal Singh; and

    c. Thursday, April 8, 2021, at 2:00 p.m. to hear witness Ben Chin.

  2. The committee noted the absence of these witnesses, who had been called to appear before the committee pursuant to the order in the motion adopted by the House on Thursday, March 25, 2021;
  3. The committee confirms that it has not released these witnesses from their obligation to appear;
  4. The committee also noted the absence of the Prime Minister, who was given the option of appearing in place of these witnesses in the motion of Thursday, March 25, 2021;
  5. The committee noted that Minister Pablo Rodriguez appeared on Monday, March 29, 2021, instead of Rick Theis, after having ordered him not to appear before the committee, as mentioned in his letter to the Chair received by committee members on Sunday, March 28, 2021; and
  6. The committee noted that Minister Mona Fortier also ordered witnesses Amitpal Singh and Ben Chin not to appear before the committee, as mentioned in her letters to the Chair dated Tuesday, March 30, 2021 and Wednesday, April 7, 2021.

That the committee report these events to the House of Commons in order to express its dissatisfaction.

Debate arose thereon.

Amendment

Greg Fergus moved, — That the motion be amended replacing the words:

“5. The committee noted that Minister Pablo Rodriguez appeared on Monday, March 29, 2021, instead of Rick Theis, after having ordered him not to appear before the committee, as mentioned in his letter to the Chair received by committee members on Sunday, March 28, 2021; and

6. The committee noted that Minister Mona Fortier also ordered witnesses Amitpal Singh and Ben Chin not to appear before the committee, as mentioned in her letters to the Chair dated Tuesday, March 30, 2021, and Wednesday, April 7, 2021.

That the committee report these events to the House of Commons in order to express its dissatisfaction.”

With the words:

“5. The committee noted that Minister Pablo Rodriguez appeared on Monday, March 29, 2021, instead of Rick Theis who followed the government instructions that staff are not to appear before committees which were outlined during the debate in the House on Thursday, March 25, 2021;

6. The committee noted that Minister Mona Fortier also requested to appear on Wednesday, March 31, 2021, and Thursday, April 8, 2021, on behalf of witnesses Amitpal Singh and Ben Chin who followed the government instructions that staff are not to appear before committees which were outlined during the debate in the House on Thursday, March 25, 2021;

That the nonattendance of witnesses be added to an annex to the main report on the study on questions of conflict of interest and lobbying in relation to pandemic spending”.

At 3:01 p.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 11:01 a.m., on Monday, May 3, 2021, the sitting resumed.

The committee resumed consideration of the amendment moved by Greg Fergus on Friday, April 30, 2021, to the motion of Rhéal Éloi Fortin moved on Thursday, April 8, 2021, which read as follows:

That the motion be amended by replacing the words:

“5. The committee noted that Minister Pablo Rodriguez appeared on Monday, March 29, 2021, instead of Rick Theis, after having ordered him not to appear before the committee, as mentioned in his letter to the Chair received by committee members on Sunday, March 28, 2021; and

6. The committee noted that Minister Mona Fortier also ordered witnesses Amitpal Singh and Ben Chin not to appear before the committee, as mentioned in her letters to the Chair dated Tuesday, March 30, 2021 and Wednesday, April 7, 2021.

That the committee report these events to the House of Commons in order to express its dissatisfaction.”

With the words:

“5. The committee noted that Minister Pablo Rodriguez appeared on Monday, March 29, 2021, instead of Rick Theis who followed the government instructions that staff are not to appear before committees which were outlined during the debate in the House on Thursday, March 25, 2021;

6. The committee noted that Minister Mona Fortier also requested to appear on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 and Thursday, April 8, 2021 on behalf of witnesses Amitpal Singh and Ben Chin who followed the government instructions that staff are not to appear before committees which were outlined during the debate in the House on Thursday, March 25, 2021;

That the nonattendance of witnesses be added to an annex to the main report on the study of questions of conflict of interest and lobbying in relation to pandemic spending.”

Debate arose thereon.

Subamendment

Michael Barrett moved, — That the amendment be amended by deleting the words “That the nonattendance of witnesses be added to an annex to the main report on the study of Questions of Conflict of Interest and Lobbying in Relation to Pandemic Spending”.

At 11:59 a.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 12:03 p.m., the sitting resumed.

The committee resumed consideration of the subamendment of Michael Barrett.

The debate continued.

At 12:12 p.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 12:26 p.m., the sitting resumed.

The committee resumed consideration of the subamendment of Michael Barrett.

The debate continued.

At 12:29 p.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 12:32 p.m., the sitting resumed.

By unanimous consent, the subamendment was withdrawn.

After debate, the question was put on the amendment of Greg Fergus and it was agreed to on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Charlie Angus, Michael Barrett, Colin Carrie, Han Dong, Greg Fergus, Rhéal Éloi Fortin, Jacques Gourde, Patricia Lattanzio, Brenda Shanahan, Francesco Sorbara — 10;

NAYS: — 0.

The question was put on the motion of Rhéal Éloi Fortin, as amended, and it was agreed to on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Charlie Angus, Michael Barrett, Colin Carrie, Han Dong, Greg Fergus, Rhéal Éloi Fortin, Jacques Gourde, Patricia Lattanzio, Brenda Shanahan, Francesco Sorbara — 10;

NAYS: — 0.

The motion as amended read as follows :

That, pursuant to the motion adopted by the House on Thursday, March 25, 2021:

  1. The committee met on:
    1. Monday, March 29, 2021, at 2 p.m. to hear witness Rick Theis;
    2. Wednesday, March 31, 2021, at 2 p.m. to hear witness Amitpal Singh; and
    3. Thursday, April 8, 2021, at 2 p.m. to hear witness Ben Chin.
  2. The committee noted the absence of these witnesses, who had been called to appear before the committee pursuant to the order in the motion adopted by the House on Thursday, March 25, 2021;
  3. 3. The committee confirms that it has not released these witnesses from their obligation to appear;
  4. The committee also noted the absence of the Prime Minister, who was given the option of appearing in place of these witnesses in the motion of Thursday, March 25, 2021;
  5. The committee noted that Minister Pablo Rodriguez appeared on Monday, March 29, 2021, instead of Rick Theis who followed the government instructions that staff are not to appear before committees which were outlined during the debate in the House on Thursday, March 25, 2021;
  6. The committee noted that Minister Mona Fortier also requested to appear on Wednesday, March 31, 2021 and Thursday, April 8, 2021 on behalf of witnesses Amitpal Singh and Ben Chin who followed the government instructions that staff are not to appear before committees which were outlined during the debate in the House on Thursday, March 25, 2021;

That the nonattendance of witnesses be added to an annex to the main report on the study of questions of conflict of interest and lobbying in relation to pandemic spending”

Motion

Michael Barrett moved, — That in relation to its study on questions of conflict of interest and lobbying in relation to pandemic spending, the committee dedicate the next two meetings, Friday, May 7, 2021, and Monday, May 10, 2021, to drafting instructions, and that the committee agree to present this report to the House by Tuesday, June 1, 2021, if possible, and that any outstanding documents be provided to the analysts as evidence to be integrated into the report.

After debate, the question was put on the motion and it was agreed to on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Charlie Angus, Michael Barrett, Colin Carrie, Han Dong, Greg Fergus, Rhéal Éloi Fortin, Jacques Gourde, Patricia Lattanzio, Brenda Shanahan, Francesco Sorbara — 10;

NAYS: — 0.

Motion

Charlie Angus moved, — That the committee do now adjourn.

The question was put on the motion and it was agreed to on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Charlie Angus, Michael Barrett, Colin Carrie, Han Dong, Greg Fergus, Rhéal Éloi Fortin, Jacques Gourde, Patricia Lattanzio, Brenda Shanahan, Francesco Sorbara — 10;

NAYS: — 0.

At 12:53 p.m., the committee adjourned to the call of the Chair.



Miriam Burke
Clerk of the Committee