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View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
It is true that we invited the cream of the crop to our first formal meeting. The bar has been set very high. You couldn't have been any clearer. I prepared some questions, but your presentations were so informative that I'm going to ask other questions.
First, when it comes to the enumeration of rights holders under section 23, you pointed out that, for 38 years, we've been neglecting the two-thirds of children who could have potentially attended French-language elementary, intermediate, secondary and post-secondary schools all over the country where services were available. We've ignored them, turned our backs on them. That's the message you conveyed to us.
Second, let's consider the short-form census versus the long-form census. We all understand quite well now the absolute importance of knocking on every single door and getting the form to every community member in Canada so we can ascertain where they are, geographically speaking. I believe that was your message. Not only is it important to know how many francophones there are in Canada—or anglophones in Quebec—but it is also important to know where they live, because that's what will show whether the numbers warrant services or not.
Can you speak in more detail about the shift in Canada's francophone community? There's been a lot of movement since I was young. The community isn't necessarily where you'd expect to find it today. When I was young, there were typical well-established French-speaking households, but now I'm seeing that some francophone households have moved. Figuring out francophones' geographic location is important.
In what way is that important to you? How does all that tie in to the short form census?
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
As I understand it, and correct me if I'm wrong, the example you gave, or even Mr. Chartrand's case, speaks to the fact that some schools have 200% occupancy rates and as many as 24 portables—the exact numbers elude me right now. That is more or less your argument to demonstrate that the long-form census is inadequate. Your example shows that rights holders aren't being properly enumerated. It's a useful example. Do you agree?
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
How important is it for the courts to hear the numbers—
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
I have another quick question.
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
Okay. The information has to come from the witnesses, even if we know it.
Didn't the British Columbia and Alberta governments send a letter to the minister in charge? Can you tell us about the letter?
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
But you forgot me, Mr. Chair.
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
First, the subcommittee has to meet. This morning, I was all by myself, without even a cup of coffee to make me happy.
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
We can talk about the subcommittee later.
Mr. Généreux, I would not want to change the nature of the motion, but here is my opinion.
Let us move away from the context of post-secondary education and foreign students. We have heard that Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship Canada has not achieved its objective for francophone immigration, a minimum of 4%. If I recall correctly, the figure is not even 1.8%. After the report we did two or three years ago—Ms. Lecompte will remember the year, as she is our collective memory—a door kind of opened for francophone immigration that was a little more effective.
I do not want to change the nature of the motion, but should we not take advantage of it to do some follow-up and see what the situation is after our recommendation, after that door opened for francophones? The issue still is immigration.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Welcome everyone.
Pursuant to Standing Order 108, we are studying the business risk management program. We have witnesses with us today.
First, I would like to take a minute to talk about our next meeting on Thursday, when we will have the supplementary estimates with the minister. For your information, because of the motion that was passed in the House yesterday, we're not able to go back. These estimates are deemed to have been adopted. There is no use voting on them on Thursday because we cannot go back and move them in the House.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Without further ado, let's go to our invited guests. From the Canadian Federation of Agriculture, we have Chris van den Heuvel, second vice-president. Thank you for being here.
We also have from Catalyst LLP, Candace Roberts, manager, by video conference from Calgary, Alberta. Welcome to our committee.
We also have, from Farm Management Canada, Mr. Mathieu Lipari, program manager. Bienvenu, M. Lipari.
There is up to 10 minutes for opening statements. You can start, Mr. van den Heuvel.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. van den Heuvel.
I apologize to Mr. Ross for failing to recognize him. He is the assistant executive director, who is also here with the federation.
Mr. Lipari.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Monsieur Lipari.
Now, by video conference, we have Ms. Candace Roberts.
You have up to 10 minutes. Go ahead.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you very much, Ms. Roberts.
Now we'll move to our question portion.
Mr. Barlow, you have six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
You have 15 seconds.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you.
We have Mr. Tim Louis for six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
We're actually out of time. Maybe we can pick it up with another question.
A voice: It's an important question.
The Chair: It's an important question for sure.
Mr. Perron, you have the floor for six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. van den Heuvel.
Monsieur Perron, thank you.
Mr. MacGregor, you have six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you.
Now it's Ms. Rood for up to five minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Ms. Rood.
Mr. Blois, you may take five minutes, please.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Ross.
Thank you, Mr. Blois.
Unfortunately, that's all the time we have for our first panel.
I want to thank everyone from the Canadian Federation of Agriculture, Mr. Chris van den Heuvel and also Mr. Scott Ross; and also from Farm Management of Canada, Monsieur Lipari; and also joining us by video conference, Ms. Candace Roberts. Thank you so much for taking the time to help us in our study.
We'll break for a few minutes to get a new panel in, and we'll come back again after
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
We're okay for our second hour of study on business risk management. We have from Keystone Agricultural Producers, by video conference, Ms. Patty Rosher.
Can you hear us, Ms. Rosher?
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Welcome to our committee.
Also, from the National Farmers Union, here in person, we have Ms. Katie Ward, president.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thanks for being with us today to talk about business risk management programs.
By videoconference, we will also hear from vice-president Martin Caron and coordinator David Tougas, both from the Union des producteurs agricoles.
Thank you for being here, everyone, and welcome to our meeting on the study of business risk management programs.
Each witness will have the floor for 10 minutes to deliver their opening remarks.
From the Keystone Agricultural Producers, Ms. Patty Rosher, do you want to get going with a 10-minute opening statement?
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Ms. Rosher.
Now, in person, we have Katie Ward from the National Farmers Union for up to 10 minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you very much, Ms. Ward.
We now go to the representatives of the Union des producteurs agricoles.
Gentlemen, you have 10 minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Caron.
We will now begin the first round of questions.
Mr. Lehoux, you have six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Unfortunately, your time is up.
Mr. Ellis, you're on for up to six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Mr. Perron, the floor is yours for six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Caron and Mr. Perron.
The floor now goes to
Mr. MacGregor for up to six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Ms. Rosher. Unfortunately, we're out of time.
The second round is going to be a bit short. I'm going to have to cut it to three minutes each.
Mr. Soroka, you have three minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Ms. Rosher.
Thank you, Mr. Soroka.
Mr. Drouin, the floor is yours for three minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Does everybody want to hear the answer?
Some hon. members: Agreed.
The Chair: Okay, let's hear the answer, and we'll close on that.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
That is all the time we have. I certainly want to thank all of you: Patty Rosher from Keystone Agricultural Producers, and from National Farmers Union, Katie Ward.
My thanks also go to Martin Caron and David Tougas, from the Union des producteurs agricoles, for taking the time to help us with our study of these programs, a study that will be the subject of our next report to the government.
Thank you, everyone.
The meeting is adjourned.
View Rob Moore Profile
CPC (NB)
Thank you, Minister, for appearing here today on this important bill. Thank you for the recognition of the role that the Honourable Rona Ambrose played in the bill getting here to this point.
Conservatives are pleased to support this legislation, and as we enter this phase of the committee doing its work, it's important for us to take a strong look at the legislation and hear from witnesses and you on the bill. We just heard from the Canadian Judicial Council and the National Judicial Institute. I know you mentioned in your remarks the importance of judicial independence, and that was a theme of some of that conversation. They've put forward a proposal for softening some of the mandatory language in the bill—for example, where it says “shall” replacing it with “should”. Can you comment on their proposal in the name of judicial independence?
View Rob Moore Profile
CPC (NB)
Thank you, Minister.
I have another question. The Honourable Justice Michael MacDonald is asking for trust in this body to implement without the imposition of the language around mandatory. I think that's an important testimony that we take note of.
Justice MacDonald raises a concern that this bill starts a trend whereby there'd be more and more mandatory courses for judges. That's not a trend, I don't think, that I would like to see come to fruition. We know that there is a great deal of training for our judges. Do you think that's a legitimate concern? How do we keep that in check, in light of the paramount role that our judges play and the importance of judicial independence in our entire system, sending the message that this wouldn't begin a trend whereby new mandatory training take place for our judges on different issues?
View Rob Moore Profile
CPC (NB)
Thank you, Minister.
Minister, in the minute I have remaining, do you or your officials have any examples now of groups or organizations that would be consulted on the seminars relating to sexual assault that will be established? Is there some notion of what groups you'd like to see consulted on those seminars?
View Rob Moore Profile
CPC (NB)
Thanks, Minister.
View John Williamson Profile
CPC (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I appreciate it.
Thank you for starting a few minutes early. I really do not want to take a lot of time away from our witnesses today.
Other members of the committee likely received last week the motion that I am putting forward for consideration this morning.
Is it common to read out the motion?
View John Williamson Profile
CPC (NB)
I move the following:
That the committee express its grave concern over the arrest of Jimmy Lai Chee-ying, Lee Cheuk-yan and Yeung Sum in Hong Kong, and that this be reported to the House.
To give you a little background, 22 years ago I started working for the National Post newspapers. As we were launching the paper, I had a brief conversation with Conrad Black, who was then residing in London. Mr. Black told me and others that he was coming from the most dynamic news market in the world, that being London, England. I took a moment to correct him and said, “Actually, no. In my opinion, the most dynamic news market in the world is Hong Kong.”
Jimmy Lai is the founder of the Apple Daily newspaper. He's a contributor to the Wall Street Journal. It is deeply concerning that he and two former lawmakers in the special administrative region of Hong Kong were recently arrested. I think this does warrant special consideration by the Parliament of Canada. I don't know if members have had a chance to go over the stories around the detention and arrest here. It is the motivation for my motion to raise this.
The challenge here is that the People's Republic of China agreed to fulfill the basic law, and the position of the Government of Canada is not to force upon China obligations that it did not agree to 23 years ago but to fulfill those obligations. Those obligations were to allow the special administrative region of Hong Kong to continue with its system of government, which allows for the free expression and free assembly rights that we hold dear in this country.
I'll pause there, Mr. Chairman, and hopefully move it to a vote.
View John Williamson Profile
CPC (NB)
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
To our two witnesses today, thank you very much for appearing. It's been very interesting.
Mr. Balloch, you had an interesting observation, or perhaps conclusion, which caught my attention: “Engagement has always been principally aimed at serving Canadian interests, and only indirectly at encouraging systemic internal change in China.” Could you elaborate on this a little more?
Are you summarizing the Government of Canada's policy? Was this the policy within the Department of Foreign Affairs or was it the policy from the ambassador's desk in Beijing?
View John Williamson Profile
CPC (NB)
Am I wrong in thinking that underlying that, whether it was the debate around granting—this is going back 30 years or at least 25 years—most favoured nation status, the WTO...? There was, at least as it was sold to the public, always an underlying emphasis that trade is good but trade will also result in a gradual change in China's outlook when it comes to being rules-based and when it comes to respect for human rights.
Internally, regarding trade, I can see how that would benefit Canada, but externally to the public there was always an underlying emphasis on rights.
View John Williamson Profile
CPC (NB)
In light of where we are today, should this trade focus continue, or is it time, perhaps, to put a greater emphasis on—and I think you've both been speaking to this today—where the relationship has not worked as well as we'd hoped, whether it's minorities being detained in the western part of the country or the two Canadians, and there are more actually, being detained as well?
We had someone here speaking from the department, saying that the focus is trade and engagement, and that is going to continue. Might we not want to reset that dial now and perhaps warn businesses in Canada that if they trade in China there are obvious risks, and for the Government of Canada to put a greater accent on the relationship on rights, internally, in China?
View John Williamson Profile
CPC (NB)
However, your earlier comments suggested very much that we were unidimensional, that it was economics-based—
View John Williamson Profile
CPC (NB)
I agree with that, and that is also a function of China's becoming a much bigger player as well.
View John Williamson Profile
CPC (NB)
Thirty years ago, I don't think they were in a position to play the influential role they do today.
I think Mr. Saint-Jacques referenced free trade. Would you embark on a free trade agreement with China today, or do you think that should be put into the deep freeze?
View John Williamson Profile
CPC (NB)
View John Williamson Profile
CPC (NB)
View John Williamson Profile
CPC (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I'd like to give our guests the floor and to follow up on what my colleague asked about, the resilience and the strength of the Chinese Communist Party and whether it is a system that is as strong as it appears to be, or if, in fact, there are weaknesses that perhaps we don't see.
I'll turn it over to the three of you. You can police yourselves to have about 90 seconds each. Why don't we start with Ms. Sun, please?
View John Williamson Profile
CPC (NB)
Chair, what is the time?
View John Williamson Profile
CPC (NB)
All right. If you would like to split the time, please go ahead. If you finish up, I'll come up with another question.
View Wayne Long Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Chair.
I think we need to step back, though, and recognize it. I just counted up nine weeks, so I think we have 18 meetings. We all know that there are going to be votes and there are going to be things that happen, so I think it's prudent that we combine all of these. I don't think we need to talk endlessly to ministers. We'll get the two ministers in for two hours, and in the next meeting we can do that again. I think that's more than enough time.
Thank you.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Good afternoon and welcome, everyone.
Today, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), the standing committee will have a briefing from the Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food.
We have with us from the department Ms. Kara Beckles, director general of the research and analysis directorate, strategic policy branch; Mr. Tom Rosser, assistant deputy minister, strategic policy branch, who has been here before; and Mr. Marco Valicenti, director general of the sector development and analysis directorate, market and industry services branch.
Welcome, lady and gentlemen. Thank you for being here with us today.
I don't know if you want a 10-minute statement between the three of you, or if each of you wishes to make a statement.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Okay.
So please go ahead.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you.
We will now go to our question round, and we'll start with Ms. Rood for six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Unfortunately, you are out of time. Perhaps you can ask that question later on.
Mr. Blois, you have six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Rosser.
Thank you, Mr. Blois.
Mr. Perron, you have the floor for six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Mr. MacGregor, for six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Valicenti. I have to stop you here.
Mr. Lawrence, I understand you will be splitting your time with Ms. Rood. You have six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Unfortunately, we're out of time on that one. I meant to say that the second round was five minutes instead of six.
Mr. Drouin, you have the floor for five minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Drouin.
Mr. Lehoux, you have the floor for five minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
We are running out of time.
There is not enough time for a full question.
Mr. Blois, you have maybe two minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
That will be a statement rather than a question. We'll have to end it here.
I want to thank the panel for coming to us this afternoon on very short notice. Thanks for the information.
We'll suspend for two or three minutes to get the new panel in.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Welcome to the second half of our business risk management programs.
With us in the second portion we have, from the Department of Agriculture and Agri-Food, Paul Samson, assistant deputy minister, programs branch; and Francesco Del Bianco, director general, business risk management directorate, programs branch. Welcome to both of you.
You can open on this for up to 10 minutes if you wish. Do you each have a presentation? Just one, okay, go ahead.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you very much, Mr. Samson.
We should start our questioning round starting with Ms. Rood.
I will also say happy birthday to you. You have six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Yes, you can answer them at.... You know.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Now, we will go to Mr. Ellis for six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
About a minute and 45 seconds.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Ellis.
Mr. Perron, you have six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Perron.
We have Mr. MacGregor for six minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Samson.
Now Mr. Soroka will be splitting time with Mr. Lawrence. Go ahead.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Lawrence.
Mr. Blois, you have five minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Again, Mr. Blois, I won't be able to—
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Mr. Lehoux, you have five minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Lehoux.
Mr. Drouin, you have five minutes.
View Pat Finnigan Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Samson and Mr. Drouin.
That concludes this round of questions.
I would like to thank Mr. Del Bianco and Mr. Samson for their time. It will certainly help us in the study that will follow with our partners. I would like to thank them for taking the time to come and testify.
Have a good day.
The meeting is adjourned.
View Richard Bragdon Profile
CPC (NB)
Seeing as the retabling of the documents from the previous Parliament is something we can handle relatively quickly, could we do that today or do that quite early on and have that taken care of and put back before Parliament?
View Richard Bragdon Profile
CPC (NB)
As soon as we can get that done, that would be great. Thank you.
View Wayne Long Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I have a few thoughts. Did we not discuss, last meeting, that administrative matters would go in camera? That's just something I'd like you to consider because I think we are talking about administrative matters.
Second, it is a new Parliament. We are a minority government—I recognize that—but we do serve motions 48 hours in advance for everybody to see, for everybody to ponder, for everybody to talk to colleagues about and so on.
I would also throw out there that, obviously, as a team on this side, we want to move forward with this study on indigenous housing and the challenges that first nations communities face. Maybe we can move forward and move this one as the first order of business. Then, maybe we can discuss the other motions after that. I'll throw that out to you for consideration.
View Wayne Long Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you to MP Kusie for also recognizing that the motion is important. One of the reasons I wanted to bring that motion forward was that I certainly have a lot of developers or proponents in my riding who are frustrated, because, especially through the co-investment fund, there are monies available there through CMHC but they're having trouble grabbing those monies, pulling those monies down. I have individual proponents who have had a long application process, had to spend money. From a federal government perspective, I think it's prudent for us to look at how we can streamline that, how we can make that program available to developers who need it. I think CMHC is also looking for areas where they can improve that.
I thank you for bringing that forward.
View Wayne Long Profile
Lib. (NB)
Could you read that again?
View Wayne Long Profile
Lib. (NB)
Although I certainly understand what MP Gazan is undertaking here, the only concern I would have with that amendment would be.... We all know that through the bilateral agreements, all that housing money goes out through the province, or the co-investment fund is a direct way, through CMHC, to circumvent the bilats.
I'll throw it out for debate, but my concern would be that we're opening up a whole...delving into provincial jurisdiction that I think complicates what I was trying to get at with that study.
View Wayne Long Profile
Lib. (NB)
I can support the amendment. It's important, though, that we recognize that we want to investigate ways that we as a federal government can make more money for housing available.
To MP Vaughan's point, you can go province to province. You can say the government in New Brunswick isn't spending enough money on affordable housing, but maybe the government in New Brunswick ran on a platform of more austerity.
I'm good with the amendment. I certainly will support it. I thank MP Kusie for bringing the whole thing forward. I caution, though, that we don't want to go down a rabbit hole of going province by province and looking at each government. Every government has a different platform and a different strategy on housing, which, obviously, we may not agree with.
Anyway, I will just throw that out there.
View Wayne Long Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Chair.
I think that is a good motion. It's something we deal with weekly in our constituency office, grandparents coming in as full-time guardians of their grandchildren and the lack of recognition and lack of support they get. I certainly will be supporting the motion.
View Wayne Long Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Chair.
I was just trying to wordsmith that a bit. I thought that maybe it could be “economic impacts and overall well-being of Canadian families who have, other than their parents, guardians of grandchildren”. Is that too...? I tried.
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
Yes and no. I'm in the same situation as you. The documents were sent through the A1 parliamentary email account and not through the P9 account.
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
Only through the P9 account?
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
I would like to rewind, and I apologize to everyone.
I realize that my motion does not require a report at the end of the study.
Can we still produce a report?
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
Yes, but I don't want to be caught off guard at the end.
I don't remember us including this in our motions before.
I think everyone expects a report to be prepared after this study.
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
Can I move the following amendment?
I would add: “and that at the end of the study, a report be produced.”
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
Yes, but we need everyone's consent.
Mr. Angus, I didn't add that at the end of the study we would produce a report.
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
This is the motion. It's the motion I want to make.
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
Should I be the one to move the motion?
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
So I'm asking the clerk what the easiest and quickest way is to say that the committee has to report to the House at the end.
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
You read my mind.
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
That is exactly what I wanted to say.
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
All right, but then we need days or hours to produce the report and to work on that report. We have to go through it.
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
I firmly reiterate this motion, which was so well read in my mind by the clerk.
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