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View Scott Simms Profile
Lib. (NL)
Welcome, everybody, to the 46th meeting of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage.
Pursuant to Standing Order 108(2) and the motion adopted in committee on June 11, 2021, the committee will commence consideration of the study of funding to locate the remains of indigenous children buried on the grounds of former residential schools.
Today’s meeting is taking place in a hybrid format, both virtual and in person, pursuant to the House order of January 25, 2021. The webcast will always show the person speaking rather than the entirety of the committee. It will be shown on the House of Commons website once it's available. There will be no photos for social media use. Thank you very much for abiding by that.
I want to make one statement before we commence today's meeting. This is for all staff. Today’s meeting might include some difficult testimony that can affect people in many ways. House employees, including members and their staff, can access support through the administration’s nurse counsellors at ohs-sst@parl.gc.ca, and the employee and family assistance program at 1-800-663-1142. This information is available on the House of Commons website or you can follow up with me or the clerk.
That being said, I want to welcome everyone on this beautiful Friday. It is a beautiful Friday, at least in my neck of the woods here on this little [Technical difficulty—Editor] Newfoundland, the unceded territory of the Mi’kmaq as well as Beothuk.
First of all, I want to acknowledge the fact that we are dealing with a motion from Mr. Waugh. I thank him for that.
I want to welcome our guests. Joining us from the Department of Canadian Heritage is Emmanuelle Sajous, assistant deputy minister, sport, major events and commemorations; and Melanie Kwong, director general, major events, commemoration and capital experience. Joining us from Crown-Indigenous Relations and Northern Affairs Canada is Amanda McCarthy, director, resolution and partnerships.
As you know, we start with a statement from our officials. We say as a guideline that it's five minutes, but I won't be terribly strict about this. We have perhaps a little bit more than an hour to do our meeting today. I would like to do two rounds of questioning.
Ms. Kwong, you have the floor for five minutes. Welcome.
Melanie Kwong
View Melanie Kwong Profile
Melanie Kwong
2021-06-18 13:06
Thank you, Mr. Chair and committee members.
I would just like to mention that my colleague Emmanuelle is having some connection difficulties, so I'll be speaking on her behalf to begin the remarks.
Dear members of the Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage. I'm pleased to be appearing before you today.
Recognizing that I'm speaking on my colleague's behalf, I would like to acknowledge that today I'm speaking to you from the Treaty No. 7 territory of the Stoney Nakoda and Blackfoot Confederacy, as well as Métis region 3 in Alberta.
I'm here to give you information on funding provided by the Department of Canadian Heritage for activities related to the commemoration of the history and legacy of residential schools.
First, I would like to acknowledge the committee's support in making the National Day for Truth and Reconciliation a reality. This year, on September 30, we will mark the first anniversary of this important day that will help ensure that the tragic history and legacy of residential schools are not forgotten and remain a vital component of the reconciliation process.
In 2019, the federal budget provided $7 million over two years for projects to raise awareness of the history and legacy of residential schools and to honour survivors, families and communities. The department developed a two-year strategy. The first year we funded large-scale national initiatives that have an educational and legacy component. The second year was for community-based projects suited to meet specific needs, histories and realities.
This funding provided grants and contributions to eligible recipients for initiatives that helped raise awareness regarding the history and legacy of residential schools and for activities that enabled communities to recognize, commemorate and honour survivors, their families and communities. Interest in this special initiative was remarkable with over 350 applications totalling $14 million in requested funding, despite the challenges caused by the pandemic.
Between 2019 and 2021, several national events and 203 community projects were funded. Examples of eligible projects include: healing gardens, ceremonies, healing workshops, elder presentations, speaker series, commemorative plaques and monuments, educational and awareness material, and cultural and artistic initiatives.
These numbers show the interest and need for these types of commemorative activities and funding to support them.
I'm happy to report that budget 2021 made the funding announced in budget 2019 permanent, with $13.4 million over the next five years and $2.4 million in ongoing support. The department will be engaging indigenous groups, survivor organizations and communities to determine how best to allocate funds. It is critical to engage to ensure this funding best meets the needs of indigenous communities and that we adhere to the principle of “nothing about us without us”.
In parallel with this national engagement, the department will collaborate with national organizations for large‑scale commemorative events in 2021 that will continue to raise awareness regarding the history and legacy that I talked about earlier.
To speak specifically on the paths to healing project, I have some points of clarification.
The Tk’emlúps te Secwépemc received a $40,000 grant for a project they called “paths to healing”. This was in the context of the funding I mentioned previously that was announced in 2019.
The objective of the program was to commemorate the history and legacy of residential schools and to honour survivors, their families and communities. The project submitted by the community was in fact for the creation of a permanent memorial site and included improvements such as benches, plants, gardens and paths within the existing heritage park. It also included commemorative events centred around Orange Shirt Day.
The use of the ground-penetrating radar technology was one of the measures taken as part of the development of this initiative. In effect, one can say that the Canadian Heritage funding contributed to the identification of the remains. However, this find was not the original intended specific purpose of the project.
Other federal departments, such as Crown‑Indigenous Relations and Northern Affairs Canada, have their own initiatives that address certain calls to action of the Truth and Reconciliation Commission of Canada. These initiatives relate to their specific mandates.
In the specific case of missing children and burials, the Department of Crown‑Indigenous Relations and Northern Affairs Canada is the lead for calls to action 74 to 76.
This concludes my opening remarks.
Thank you.
Emmanuelle Sajous
View Emmanuelle Sajous Profile
Emmanuelle Sajous
2021-06-18 13:11
Good afternoon. I'm tremendously sorry.
My name is Emmanuelle Sajous.
I am the assistant deputy minister at Canadian Heritage, for sport, commemorations and major events. It's nice to be here today. Thank you.
View Kevin Waugh Profile
CPC (SK)
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you to our guests. This has been a particularly hard time in our country and I felt it very important to bring department officials forward to speak about the paths of healing and the situation in Kamloops.
When I look at the Kamloops, when Canadian Heritage gave the $40,000 grant, I see that part of it was for the ground-penetrating radar that identified the 215 gravesites.
How many other residential schools in this country have applied for the grant and the GPR? I know my province of Saskatchewan is actively involved right now, and I'm going to talk about that in a moment, but from the Kamloops story, how many now have contacted the heritage department requesting funding for the GPR?
Emmanuelle Sajous
View Emmanuelle Sajous Profile
Emmanuelle Sajous
2021-06-18 13:13
Thank you.
As you heard in the opening remarks, the purpose of Canadian Heritage's commemorations program is to educate Canadians on the history of residential schools and create a positive environment for reconciliation. The program's goals boil down to awareness, education and promotion. We received over 350 funding applications over the course of the program. Canadian Heritage provided $3.5 million in funding for 203 projects, and Kamloops received $40,000 for a project to build a healing garden and a reconciliation centre. The horrifying discovery happened over the course of that project. The funding was earmarked for a healing garden.
I'll now give the floor to my Crown‑Indigenous Relations and Northern Affairs Canada, or CIRNAC, colleague, who will provide additional information on the number of communities that asked for radars. Ms. McCarthy?
Amanda McCarthy
View Amanda McCarthy Profile
Amanda McCarthy
2021-06-18 13:15
Thank you very much for inviting me here.
At this moment, I can say that we've received over 17 requests for more information about the funding envelope. We've provided them with the necessary information for them to access the funding. At this point we've not received more than 10 proposals, as communities work through this very difficult tragedy and listen to their communities and their survivors about the best approach to move forward.
We are here to offer our support and the resources [Technical difficulty—Editor] survivors, their organizations and communities are ready.
View Kevin Waugh Profile
CPC (SK)
Thank you.
We have lots in Saskatchewan where I come from, such as the Battleford Indian Industrial School. We have the Star Blanket Cree Nation. We have so many in our province now that are going to reach out.
There was a story in the CBC that now certain organizations want to rent these ground-penetrating radar services and go to the first nations, the indigenous groups, in my province and others. They say they have the expertise. In fact, I see SNC-Lavalin has offered their services to many in Saskatchewan and to others in this country.
I'm a little concerned about the scam aspect of this, because you really need expertise in ground-penetrating radar and how to operate it and identify it. CBC has done a very good story on the scams that are coming forward. I'm very worried that this is going to overtake what really should be happening—access to funds either from INAN or from Canadian Heritage and doing it properly—because if it isn't done properly, this is going to be another disaster in this country.
Do you have any thoughts on that?
Amanda McCarthy
View Amanda McCarthy Profile
Amanda McCarthy
2021-06-18 13:17
Thank you for that.
We engaged with over 150 participants during summer and fall 2020, and we overwhelming heard that the approach that Canada should take should be to facilitate access to resources, but the project should be community-led and informed by survivors.
We're currently reaching out with colleagues and other professionals to start the conversation about how to provide a sense of guidance on ground-penetrating radar that communities can access to enable them to make informed decisions.
View Kevin Waugh Profile
CPC (SK)
I sat on INAN for two years, and the money, as you mentioned, supposedly was there. There was $33 million over three years, and there's still $27 million left.
I heard the testimony from the National Centre of Truth and Reconciliation. It received $2.6 million to develop and maintain a student death register. However, it says the money is not flowing, and I would agree with the centre.
The program started in 2019 with over $33 million, and we've only seen $3 million to $4 million out. What is the issue here? We still have $27 million available two years later. What is the issue we are seeing in this country and the departments?
Amanda McCarthy
View Amanda McCarthy Profile
Amanda McCarthy
2021-06-18 13:19
We wanted to make sure we engaged with survivor organizations, indigenous leaders, health practitioners and archaeologists. We did that engagement over the summer and fall of last year. We had delays due to the pandemic. We supported the communities by identifying their priorities, and supported them and their members during that difficult time. We completed the engagement in November 2020, and as you're aware we now have the $27.1 million available.
View Scott Simms Profile
Lib. (NL)
Thank you, Ms. McCarthy, and thank you, Mr. Waugh.
We're now going to Mr. Battiste, who is not a regular member of our committee, but is a special guest today with his expertise. We certainly welcome him.
I know your riding is in Cape Breton, and Sydney is in it, but I've forgotten the official name.
View Jaime Battiste Profile
Lib. (NS)
I want to thank the heritage committee for giving me some time today to talk about this really important issue.
I've heard some of the members and some of the discussion regarding the need to raise awareness in commemorating Indian residential schools.
I'd like to begin by looking at some of the work we've done as a government. Yesterday, we were lucky enough to vote on Bill C-15 on UNDRIP, which was mentioned seven times in the TRC's calls to action. We've also done important work in terms of establishing a language commissioner last week, as well as the TRC calls to action regarding the National Day for Truth and Reconciliation.
We've taken a lot of big steps in government in terms of fulfilling the calls to action, but across the country there were 130 different residential schools. In a lot of these places, there is no commemoration. There is no plaque. There's nothing. As for the only residential school we had in Nova Scotia and New Brunswick, there is a farm there now. There's nothing there to commemorate all of the children whose lives were lost, and all of the communities that had to go there.
Could you talk to me a bit about the $27 million our government has put towards ensuring that we move forward on the calls to action? Why is it important that these processes be indigenous-led and not government-led, community-based and based on the survivors of the residential schools, which were very different all across Canada.
I want you to speak to that a bit.
Emmanuelle Sajous
View Emmanuelle Sajous Profile
Emmanuelle Sajous
2021-06-18 13:22
First of all, budget 2019 did in fact allocate $7 million over two years for Canadian Heritage to address residential schools.
The objective of the money was to increase awareness; to commemorate the legacy; to honour the memory of the residential school survivors, the families and communities; and to provide an opportunity for survivors to talk about this dark period of our history.
In budget 2021, we were able to get $13.4 million over five years. We now have $2.4 million a year to continue on this path and to commemorate the legacy of residential schools.
I will turn to Ms. McCarthy. Maybe you can talk about your own calls to action, and what you're doing on your side.
Amanda McCarthy
View Amanda McCarthy Profile
Amanda McCarthy
2021-06-18 13:23
The $27.1 million is the funding that's now available from the $33.8 million specifically targeted for calls to action 74 to 76. The funding is dedicated to supporting indigenous communities and survivors' organizations and their partners in locating, documenting, maintaining and commemorating burial sites associated with former residential schools, and responding to family wishes to commemorate and memorialize their losses and the children's final resting places.
View Jaime Battiste Profile
Lib. (NS)
Okay. If that's all, then, I want to touch on education a little bit. We're talking about commemoration and we're talking about raising awareness. A lot of the education components of moving forward on the calls to action [Technical difficulty—Editor] provinces and federal collaboration. Now with the truth and reconciliation day of September 30, can you talk a little about what opportunities exist around heritage in terms of how we can create more awareness and education around the Indian residential schools?
Feel free to chime in, anyone.
Emmanuelle Sajous
View Emmanuelle Sajous Profile
Emmanuelle Sajous
2021-06-18 13:25
I'm sorry. The connection is not very good on my side. I'm not sure I understood the whole question.
View Jaime Battiste Profile
Lib. (NS)
Okay.
How can we in Canada, with our provincial governments, create more awareness and education around the Indian residential schools?
Melanie Kwong
View Melanie Kwong Profile
Melanie Kwong
2021-06-18 13:26
Sure.
In terms of education for the national day, we look forward to the first opportunity this year, now that we have the confirmation of the statutory holiday, to work with organizations nationally but also to engage to see where we can all work together on this important day. Using some of the work we've done to date in terms of commemorating a number of projects, we are continuing to work with contacts across the country. We look forward to continuing to build on the success to date.
With respect to the provinces, as you mentioned, there is a component for education. We will explore all avenues to see how we can best work together on that.
View Jaime Battiste Profile
Lib. (NS)
Can you just expand a bit on what the $2.4 million in permanent funding coming from Canadian Heritage will address when it comes to commemoration?
Melanie Kwong
View Melanie Kwong Profile
Melanie Kwong
2021-06-18 13:28
If it's all right, just because of the connection issues, maybe I'll start and then Emmanuelle can add to it, if she wants.
What the $2.4 million offers is the ongoing funding that we're very happy to know will exist in that we will be able to continue [Technical difficulty—Editor] two-year funding that was initially announced. Again, building off of the work that's been done to date, I think there's more work to be done in terms of the national piece. It was mentioned earlier that the funding announced in 2019 allowed us to do a two-year plan, where we did a national focus in the first year and then a number of community-based projects in the second year. Our focus will now be on engaging, as my colleague Amanda McCarthy said, with the organizations and representatives who will be most using the funding, now that we have that permanency, to see how best we can use those funds. That will be the approach.
Thank you.
View Sylvie Bérubé Profile
BQ (QC)
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I'm speaking today from the traditional Cree and Anishinabe territory of Abitibi—Baie‑James—Nunavik—Eeyou, Quebec.
I'm pleased to participate in this meeting of the Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage. I wish to welcome all the witnesses who are with us today.
My question is the following: what is the government's plan for excavations? We know full well that several indigenous communities, in the wake of what happened in Kamloops [Technical difficulty—Editor] Quebec, and elsewhere in Canada—I'm not forgetting that—have decided to start excavating.
So, what is your action plan to help indigenous communities?
Amanda McCarthy
View Amanda McCarthy Profile
Amanda McCarthy
2021-06-18 13:31
Thank you very much.
I'll try this with the video on, but I'll turn it off if I'm signalled that people can't hear me clearly.
The $27.1 million was announced in order to support the implementation of calls to action 74 to 76. It is accessible to indigenous organizations, communities and survivor organizations.
We are waiting to hear from indigenous voices on how best they would like us to proceed. The plan at this point is for Canada to be a facilitator of access to the support and the resources [Technical difficulty—Editor] obstacles to providing that support and listening to them on how they would like to proceed.
View Sylvie Bérubé Profile
BQ (QC)
Let's clear the air on the $27 million that were earmarked to excavate residential school grounds. Why didn't these excavations proceed? What happened? The Prime Minister has been claiming to uphold reconciliation with indigenous peoples and communities for over six years now, yet nothing has happened.
Why aren't things moving forward, and why is it taking so long?
Amanda McCarthy
View Amanda McCarthy Profile
Amanda McCarthy
2021-06-18 13:32
Thank you for the question.
We invited over 200 organizations, and approximately 150 participated in a national virtual engagement last summer and fall, in 2020. We wanted to hear from [Technical difficulty—Editor] on the best way to proceed. With the COVID pandemic, we suffered some delays in giving communities the time and the space to take the preparations they needed within their communities to address the pandemic. Then we received all of our authorities for us to proceed, and now the $27.1 million in funding is available.
We understand that this is an initial investment and that we may need to consider additional resourcing or sourcing in the future. At this point, we're listening to indigenous voices to determine the scope, the interest and how we should proceed.
View Sylvie Bérubé Profile
BQ (QC)
Yes, of course.
We heard that the funding for searching for those 215 indigenous children in Kamloops came from British Columbia.
Didn't the federal government also commit to providing funding for searching for unmarked graves on residential school grounds?
Emmanuelle Sajous
View Emmanuelle Sajous Profile
Emmanuelle Sajous
2021-06-18 13:35
Canadian Heritage funding went to building a healing garden in the Tk'emlups community. A radar was purchased for that purpose and for searching for other artefacts, and that's when the remains were found.
Canadian Heritage provided direct funding of $40,000 for this project.
View Sylvie Bérubé Profile
BQ (QC)
Thank you.
In December, the government answered my written questions regarding a status update on calls to action 81 and 82. In its response, the government revealed that only the equivalent of half of one full‑time employee was tasked with implementing call to action 81, which consists of building a monument in Ottawa to commemorate the victims of residential schools. When I asked Indigenous Services Canada officials this question [Technical difficulty—Editor]. So, I'll ask you the question.
Wouldn't you say that this effort isn't enough to implement the call to action?
Emmanuelle Sajous
View Emmanuelle Sajous Profile
Emmanuelle Sajous
2021-06-18 13:36
I'll start answering the question, and then let my colleague, Ms. Kwong, have the floor.
Call to action 81 calls for a monument in Ottawa to commemorate residential schools, the survivors and the families. An entire team at Canadian Heritage is dedicated to monument planning. I'm not too sure that I understand what the 0.5 number refers to.
Ms. Kwong, would you like to add something?
Melanie Kwong
View Melanie Kwong Profile
Melanie Kwong
2021-06-18 13:36
I wonder whether the response to the question was in fact related to this project.
If I may, I would like to provide a small update on call to action 81, which calls for a monument. Obviously, we would like to continue working on this project. We've already had discussions with key stakeholders to determine their vision for the monument and to be able to proceed to the next steps.
We have a lot—
View Alexandre Boulerice Profile
NDP (QC)
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
I would like to thank the witnesses who are here with us this afternoon as we study this crucial, fundamental issue.
I can't help but make two brief remarks as an introduction.
First, the discovery of 215 children's bodies next to the Kamloops residential school shook not only Canadian politicians, but all of Canada and Quebec as well. It provided human‑scale evidence of a harrowing tragedy that went on for almost a century, where children were uprooted from their communities and abused. Several were buried without their parents knowing about it. This discovery sent out shockwaves in Ottawa. The flags are still at half‑mast, and there are flowers, teddy bears and toys next to the Centennial Flame on Parliament Hill.
I'd like to thank my colleague, Kevin Waugh, for moving this motion.
However, eloquent speeches and good intentions unfortunately don't always lead to concrete action.
This isn't a question for the witnesses, but, nonetheless, something that I would like to be recorded in the archives.
My colleague, Niki Ashton, asked the House earlier today for unanimous consent to move and pass a motion to create an independent commission with the resources to conduct searches on the grounds of residential schools and determine whether other children are also buried there—because more have been found since the Kamloops discovery. The motion also seeks to obtain the records needed to conduct those searches.
Unfortunately, the motion was defeated, particularly due to the votes of certain members of the governing party. This is extremely disappointing.
I'm not asking you to respond to those questions, Ms. Kwong, because they're more of a political nature. I have something more tangible for you.
The final report of the Truth and Reconciliation Commission of Canada has 94 calls to action. There has been little to no progress on calls to action 74, 75 and 76, despite the fact that funding has been earmarked since 2019.
When do you believe that the federal government will move forward on these calls to action?
Amanda McCarthy
View Amanda McCarthy Profile
Amanda McCarthy
2021-06-18 13:40
Thank you for the question.
It's difficult to say at this time, as we're still listening to indigenous voices as they go through this recent tragedy. As I mentioned, it's the role of government to facilitate the access to the resources, but when requested, when people are ready. This is not something that we wish to rush.
We need to make sure that we do it right. We need to make sure that it's survivors who are leading and informing the decisions. It's difficult to say at this time what the timeline may be, other than to say that Canada is here and it's ready to support and provide those resources.
View Alexandre Boulerice Profile
NDP (QC)
I understand your point of view and where you are at in your responsibilities, but it isn't very clear. It's still rather vague, unfortunately.
Earlier, Mr. Battiste asked a good question, and I would like to pick up on his idea.
I know that the federal government isn't in charge of this, but when I was young, when I was in school, in elementary or high school, I wasn't told much about the residential school tragedy. In fact, we learned about it a little late. I know that there has been a revamping of the Canadian citizenship education guide, which talks very clearing and specifically about the reality of the residential schools and this historical wound.
However, beyond that, what do you plan to do, in collaboration with the provinces, to be able to tell this tragic and dramatic story so that Canadians and Quebecers are aware of what happened, much more than what we've been told in the past? It seems to me that we have looked the other way in the last few decades. We didn't dare face the past.
Emmanuelle Sajous
View Emmanuelle Sajous Profile
Emmanuelle Sajous
2021-06-18 13:42
As I mentioned a little earlier, the money we obtained was set out in the 2019 and 2021 budgets.
The purpose of our commemoration program is really to raise awareness, to commemorate the history and legacy of residential schools, to honour survivors and their families, and to give them the opportunity to tell their stories in the context of a healing process.
In terms of examples of projects, education and awareness materials can indeed be funded from these funds. There are also commemorative plaques, exhibits, travelling displays, healing workshops with elders, and community meals and ceremonies. There are many ways and many tools available to us to make sure that this story [Technical Difficulty—Editor] this hidden side is told.
View Alexandre Boulerice Profile
NDP (QC)
In terms of the process and how you carry out your program of commemoration and remembrance of these tragic events, I would like to understand a little bit more about how you work with indigenous organizations and jurisdictions to make sure that this is done not only with them, but also by and for them.
Melanie Kwong
View Melanie Kwong Profile
Melanie Kwong
2021-06-18 13:44
I'll answer the question, if I may.
That's the way to move forward. As I mentioned, we have the experience of these 200 projects across the country. The goal is to learn what works well and what can be improved, and to determine the demands and needs.
In response to the question about education, I would say that many of the projects funded by Canadian Heritage come from indigenous communities. For example, there are books that speak to the importance of these stories locally and nationally.
View Martin Shields Profile
CPC (AB)
View Martin Shields Profile
2021-06-18 13:45
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you to the department officials for being here with us today on this very important topic.
I have a couple of comments, in the sense that as a fifth-generation family in southern Alberta, I'm very familiar with Treaty 7 and the Blackfoot Confederacy. We grew up going to school with them, knowing residential schools. My mother actually taught in a residential school. This is something I'm familiar with.
I have met with many elders, some of those people I grew up with. I have met with clans, clan leaders, hereditary chiefs and elders who have survived residential schools. I've been to grave sites, marked and unmarked, in my riding. It's probably a history that some of us are very familiar with.
When we see the $33 million and only $27 million unspent, on that $27 million unspent, you sort of wonder, why is there confusion, is it a program that has been silent? I was on the heritage committee when we did the national day of recognition. There was a lot of discussion about that one. Some of the concerns I had about it were that it's federally regulated. It's not a statutory holiday for everybody. We have a problem with that one in itself, because it doesn't apply to everybody in our country.
When we talked about that day of recognition, my questions were often, “Are you putting this on their shoulders without any supports to indigenous people? Where is the connection to the rest of society, and whose onus is it going to be to carry this? Is it the school system? How are they going to do it?”
You mentioned the book. I mentioned that book should have been written and distributed everywhere in the country.
I think we have lots of problems here, in the sense of where we are going forward.
Our national [Technical difficulty—Editor] to indigenous people, the government hired...and I met with them. There was a play written about reconciliation, to do with Siksika and the first nations, by the Strathmore High School. It was viewed in a number of places. It's a phenomenal play. I said that's the kind of play that should be in Ottawa at the National Arts Centre, to bring things to people. They said they were given no money: “We were just hired, but we have no money."
I think we have a huge challenge here, in the sense of, one, confusion on who can get the money and how, and two, it's directed, I think, to indigenous people to carry the load on this, which is problematic. We're putting it back in the wrong place. We need to have a different way, because provinces do education.
Anyways, I have rambled. To the department officials, do you have any response to the concerns I have going forward on this?
Melanie Kwong
View Melanie Kwong Profile
Melanie Kwong
2021-06-18 13:48
I might start. There was a lot of information there, and I hope I can touch on most of the pieces, Mr. Shields.
I'm glad you mentioned your experiences, because, again, perhaps using this example from the funding that Canadian Heritage has been able to provide, just exactly.... When I speak about a book, I'm just looking to make sure that I have the name of it right. Part of the funding was to support the Piikani Indian residential school interviews project, for example. It's those local projects that often include commemorative programming and the component for Orange Shirt Day, like we saw in these 200 projects, which does have the ability to join some of the recognition and commemoration pieces with activities that are happening.
I think what we've seen with these 200 projects—again, this was the second year of the two-year funding—is that we have an opportunity to learn from what has happened here and, as my colleague Amanda has said, take the feedback that we're getting in terms of indigenous voices about what we can do with this money to best [Technical difficulty—Editor] we still need to do, but a lot we can learn from what's been done.
View Martin Shields Profile
CPC (AB)
View Martin Shields Profile
2021-06-18 13:49
When you said that it was a “statutory holiday”, it's a statutory holiday for federal and federally regulated.... We have a problem right off the bat in the sense of how that's going to be viewed and worked with, as provinces don't do that.
Emmanuelle Sajous
View Emmanuelle Sajous Profile
Emmanuelle Sajous
2021-06-18 13:50
One of the goals was to make this day similar to Remembrance Day on November 11. This would be timely, as children across the country would be in school on that day. The day could be used to educate them. We could talk to them about the purpose of this day of remembrance and why it is important to remember what happened in the residential schools.
The model that will be chosen for the day of remembrance will be based on Remembrance Day of November 11.
View Martin Shields Profile
CPC (AB)
View Martin Shields Profile
2021-06-18 13:50
In western Canada, Remembrance Day is a statutory holiday, but not in the rest of the country.
View Marci Ien Profile
Lib. (ON)
View Marci Ien Profile
2021-06-18 13:50
Mr. Chair, thank you so much.
I so appreciate the witnesses who have joined us here today.
I want to thank my colleague Mr. Waugh as well for bringing forward this very important issue.
There seems to be a theme here today, and that is education or the lack thereof. Why didn't we know? It lent to the shock that everybody seemed to be in.
I want to talk a bit more about pathways to healing and what I call the “information gap”. Specifically, who is targeted in raising awareness and fostering education? Who are you targeting with that education? Who are you targeting with regard to raising awareness?
Emmanuelle Sajous
View Emmanuelle Sajous Profile
Emmanuelle Sajous
2021-06-18 13:51
As we work to implement the National Day for Truth and Reconciliation, on September 30 of each year, our first goal will be to work with indigenous communities.
So we will begin with consultations with indigenous groups, survivor groups and national indigenous organizations. We will see how best to implement this day of remembrance, how to distribute the funding, and how to properly explain the story of these people. Only after we gather all these ideas can we see how to implement them across the country.
The first thing we need to do is really engage with indigenous communities and groups to find out how they want this story to be told.
View Marci Ien Profile
Lib. (ON)
View Marci Ien Profile
2021-06-18 13:52
Yes, which makes a lot of sense because, unlike my colleague Mr. Boulerice, I didn't learn about residential schools at all when I was at school. The education gap was there and, of course, these are not stories that are being told in the media, frankly. I had a good conversation with author and journalist Tanya Talaga recently, and she said that it got to a point where she created her own production company to make sure the stories of her people were told, because there was such a gap.
I'm just wondering more about engagement with the communities. The way that it's set up, it's not top-down but bottom-up, because there are distinct indigenous nations across Canada. That is a very good thing, but I'm wondering with this engagement how children are involved. Are you involving children, who no doubt see themselves in these 215?
Emmanuelle Sajous
View Emmanuelle Sajous Profile
Emmanuelle Sajous
2021-06-18 13:53
We will begin when we do the engagement. One of our principles will be a distinctions-based consultation. We will make sure we include Métis, first nations and Inuit in those consultations.
With respect to kids, we will work with indigenous organizations, elders, survivor circles and other groups to see how they want to be consulted.
Maybe I will turn to Melanie and my colleague Amanda to see if they want to add something to this question.
View Marci Ien Profile
Lib. (ON)
View Marci Ien Profile
2021-06-18 13:54
That's not a problem.
How has the vision changed following the 215. As my colleague Mr. Battiste mentioned, with 130 residential schools across the country, we know there will be more. The 215 will be followed by many more.
What is the vision now, and how might that have changed with this discovery?
Melanie Kwong
View Melanie Kwong Profile
Melanie Kwong
2021-06-18 13:55
Thank you for the clarification.
The thinking is that, with this increased attention right now, we will be able to amplify the first official day this September 30. In terms of the vision, it was a very tragic event that has raised all of this attention. It's actually going to be capturing people's interest for some time. We hope to hear more voices about what this day means to all Canadians. We will see.
In fact, for us, the vision would be to listen and understand what people want to hear. We have that attention now.
View Martin Champoux Profile
BQ (QC)
View Martin Champoux Profile
2021-06-18 13:56
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.
I'd like to thank the witnesses once again for being with us today. This is an extremely sensitive topic we're discussing today.
I just want to be reassured, in a way. Earlier, I heard the people from the department make a connection between the funding from the Department of Canadian Heritage, that is to say the $40,000 earmarked for the creation of a memorial park, and the discovery of the children's bodies. I hope you're not making a connection between this funding and this discovery, because I would find that a bit indecent. It's a chance discovery, and I think we need to make every effort, with all of our energy and heart, to provide indigenous communities across the country with the means they will need and consider appropriate and necessary to uncover these too many tragedies that we will most likely discover in the coming months and years.
Earlier, my colleague Mr. Boulerice spoke about education received regarding indigenous history. We're from the same school system, he and I, and indeed, when we were young, in our school, we heard almost nothing about the reality of indigenous people. We heard about indigenous folklore. We thought it was charming, and it was a great story, but we realize now that the real story is completely different from what we learned in school.
We discussed this at the meetings of this committee on September 30 last year. What we were saying was that this day had to be used to correct the lack of education that existed on this issue, and that something needed to be done with this day so that it wasn't just another day off for federal public servants. We want it to be serve a purpose. It has to serve a purpose.
So I'd like you to tell me what you have in mind, because September 30, in an organizational context, is just around the corner.
What is planned, and how will you make sure this day is used, in an effective way, to educate [Technical difficulty—Editor] about the history and legacy of residential schools?
Emmanuelle Sajous
View Emmanuelle Sajous Profile
Emmanuelle Sajous
2021-06-18 13:58
Thank you for the question.
The bill received royal assent on June 4. This is an important day and an important step in our reconciliation with indigenous peoples.
As I mentioned a little earlier, the first step will be to consult indigenous communities because what's important is to see how they want this day to be celebrated. The funding—
View Martin Champoux Profile
BQ (QC)
View Martin Champoux Profile
2021-06-18 13:59
Ms. Sajous, I'm sorry for interrupting you. I don't mean to be rude, but I only have two and a half minutes of speaking time.
This day has been planned for several months. What have you done so far and what's coming up for September 30 this year?
Emmanuelle Sajous
View Emmanuelle Sajous Profile
Emmanuelle Sajous
2021-06-18 13:59
This year, we're going to organize a national event.
We're already working with indigenous organizations, including the National Centre for Truth and Reconciliation and the Aboriginal Peoples Television Network, or APTN, to organize a national event.
At the same time, we're working on a consultation plan with indigenous communities to determine how we'll celebrate on September 30 in future years.
View Alexandre Boulerice Profile
NDP (QC)
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I want to use my time to speak to Bill C‑15, An Act respecting the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples, which is before the Senate.
I'm not necessarily speaking to the witnesses, but to the chief justice of the Supreme Court, who is serving as Governor General right now. I would ask him to please give royal assent to this bill as quickly as possible. We would appreciate it very much, because we don't want to have to go through this process again, which was started by my colleague Romeo Saganash.
At the same time, I would like to reiterate that the Liberal government should end court challenges related to compensation for residential school victims and children who are not receiving their fair share of health and social services.
My question is more directly addressed to our witnesses.
There is talk of implementing a program to commemorate the victims of residential schools and to talk about the reality of residential schools. How do you plan to distribute the investments in the communities to fulfill this duty to remember? The reality has been different in many parts of the country.
There were 130 residential schools in Canada, only 11 of them were in Quebec. Of course, that doesn't take any responsibility away from Quebec. Still, I wonder if the investments will be made in proportion to the number of residential schools, victims and children who attended these institutions or if 10% of the funding will be provided by province.
What are you considering? What is the plan?
Emmanuelle Sajous
View Emmanuelle Sajous Profile
Emmanuelle Sajous
2021-06-18 14:01
Thank you for the question.
First, we'll undertake a consultation phase, which will be conducted in a manner that takes into account the particularities of rights‑bearing communities. We'll work with first nations, Inuit and Métis.
Then we'll have a better idea of how the money will be distributed. [Technical difficulty—Editor] regional to ensure that the money will be distributed across the country.
At this point, I can't tell you if these investments will be made on a per capita basis, but it will certainly be discussed in the conversations we have, and the decision will be made with indigenous communities and survivor circles.
View Alexandre Boulerice Profile
NDP (QC)
Thank you for the answer.
I'll ask one last question if I have enough time.
You talk a lot about the work that needs to be done in collaboration with indigenous communities, and rightly so. How do you plan to work with the provinces? This is another aspect that has been raised.
Emmanuelle Sajous
View Emmanuelle Sajous Profile
Emmanuelle Sajous
2021-06-18 14:02
At this point, we are planning to work primarily with indigenous communities across the country. We don't have a specific plan for the provinces yet.
Fay Blaney
View Fay Blaney Profile
Fay Blaney
2021-06-15 11:55
I couldn't get onto Zoom. It was insane.
Anyway, Cherry said to me that incest is the boot camp for prostitution. My second point that I really want to make is that indigenous girls are sexually exploited, and it leads right into being trafficked or prostituted.
In my final section, I want to offer some recommendations. I'm titling that section “Nothing About Us Without Us”. It's kind of ironic, and I'll explain that later.
In the first part about the complexities that indigenous women face, I want to borrow from the literature review that the Native Women's Association of Canada did. They cite a UN global study talks about how trafficking victims are targeted. Traffickers go after women who are young, female, poor, undereducated and who come from dysfunctional homes and are searching for a better life. To that I would add the child welfare system. Indigenous women coming out of the child welfare system are very much targeted for trafficking.
I really want to underscore the fact that there's a huge lobby in this country to legalize prostitution, the sex work lobby. They're one dimensional in their perspective. I want to point out that there are huge complexities with indigenous women that are not factored into their equation. I don't need to say a whole lot about that because there has been so much happening in the media, such as the 215 children, plus the 104 more who have been found.
We know we struggle with racism—deeply rooted racism—and genocide in this country. Out of that we have a great deal of poverty. That's showing up in the levels of homelessness across this country. Indigenous women and their children are very much impacted by that.
Further, I just think that misogyny gets missed so much in our conversations around colonization. Misogyny plays a huge role—patriarchy plays a huge role—in what's happening to indigenous women and girls.
We have a member of the Aboriginal Women's Action Network—I'm hoping she's watching today—who never lets us forget that women with disabilities are often not considered in our conversations about sexual exploitation. Often, indigenous women become disabled as a result of violence.
We're marginalized in all of the institutions across this country. There are the cases that have been brought forward by Cindy Blackstock on child welfare, and right across this country there is the fact that so many of our children are in care.
The justice system, the racism within the justice system, and the police misconduct.... It's right through the whole system; I'm not picking only on the police. There have to be justice reforms. There should have been more in the mandate of the national inquiry to address the behaviour of the justice system.
The health care system, as my friend there has mentioned, the way she was treated.... Within our first nations government even, indigenous women are marginalized in all of those systems.
Within that process, we begin to believe what's being imposed on us, what's being force-fed to us. That message comes to us daily, routinely, everywhere. Every which way you slice it, indigenous women are marked to be lesser than, so we're very much targeted for trafficking. That's deemed to be the only role that we're capable of in Canadian society.
That's my first point. The complexities that indigenous women face in how we end up being sexually exploited have to be factored in. It's not an isolated instance of, “Oh, I'm so proud to be a sex worker, look at me.” There are many more factors at play that result in women being sexually exploited in the indigenous community.
For my second point, with regard to young women and girls, I often point to Mary Ellen Turpel-Lafond's report when she was the representative for children and youth here in B.C. She released a report that looked over a three-year period. She examined all cases of sexual abuse within foster homes. The result of her study was that almost 70% of victims were indigenous girls. I think 20-something per cent were indigenous boys. When you look at all those percentages, there's barely anybody else being abused besides indigenous children.
We are definitely groomed for sexual exploitation, and we come to accept that as our fate in our lives. There are numerous other studies. I looked at the study that came out of the Vancouver Rape Relief & Women's Shelter, where they also examined 100 calls over a certain period of time. In their report they said that 12% of the callers were under the age of 14 when they were being sexually exploited, 12% were between the ages of 14 and 15, and 18% were between the ages of 16 and 18. That's pretty high when you think that almost half of indigenous callers were underage when they were being sexually exploited or trafficked.
In the report by Melissa Farley and Jacqueline Lynne, they tell us that of the women who were involved in their study, 96% of the indigenous women said they were being sexually abused as children before they entered into prostitution, or were being trafficked.
View Kevin Waugh Profile
CPC (SK)
Thank you.
We did send out the notice of motion on Wednesday, June 9, and I will read it into the record:
That the Committee invite officials from the Department of Canadian Heritage to testify about the funding for the discovery of the remains of two hundred and fifteen Indigenous children on the grounds of a former residential school in Kamloops, and what would be required to extend these efforts to all residential schools where unmarked graves may exist; and that Chief Rosanne Casimir of the Tk’emlúps te Secwépemc First Nation be invited to discuss the process of obtaining funding, how sufficient it was relative to the task, and what remains to be done.
I move my motion. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
View Marc Miller Profile
Lib. (QC)
Kwe kwe. Unnusakkut. Tansi. Hello.
Hello.
Before I begin, I want to acknowledge that in Ottawa, I'm on the traditional territory of the Algonquin Anishinabe people.
First and foremost, I do want to say a few words for the communities, families and friends impacted by the tragic news of the children whose remains were recently found at the former Kamloops residential school located on the traditional territory of the Tk'emlúps te Secwe̓pemc people.
I'd like to thank the members for their continued advocacy and echoing indigenous voices here in Parliament.
While this discovery has shocked and disturbed the nation, for indigenous peoples across the country, these findings are deeply painful, traumatizing and triggering, although they are not surprising, particularly for the indigenous peoples who have known this truth for far too long.
Our thoughts remain with the families and communities impacted not only by this discovery but by the residential school system. It is essential that we respect and continue to respect the privacy, space and mourning period of those communities that are collecting their thoughts and putting together their protocols as to how to honour these children.
We recognize that there is a continuing need for psychological wellness services associated with childhood and intergenerational trauma. We will continue to work with our partners and the communities, first and foremost to ensure adequate access to appropriate services.
The survivors and the families affected by the indigenous residential schools system have access, among other things, to the national Indian residential schools crisis line if they need it. The Indian residential schools resolution health support program also offers access to elders, to traditional healers and to other appropriate forms of cultural and emotional support, as well as to professional mental health counselling.
In addition, all indigenous peoples can access the hope for wellness help line, online or by phone, to get help. During the COVID-19 pandemic, we are offering additional support so that indigenous communities can adapt and broaden mental health services.
We also recently announced $597.6 million over three years for a mental health and wellness strategy based, of course, on the distinct characteristics of the First Nations, the Inuit and the Métis Nation. The strategy includes continuing support for former residential schools students and their families. It will be based on existing competencies and will help to fill gaps and respond to the existing, emerging and future needs of indigenous communities.
I'm here today to answer your questions on the supplementary estimates (A) for 2021-22 and to provide you with an update on continuing efforts to confront the evolving COVID-19 pandemic. I will also answer any other questions that the committee chooses.
For this year, the total authority will be $18.9 billion, which reflects a net increase of $5.4 billion. This includes support for initiatives such as funding for COVID-19 responses, including, notably, $760.7 million for the indigenous community support fund that has been so welcomed, $64 million for the continuation of public health responses in indigenous communities and $332.8 million for indigenous communities affected by disruptions to their revenue due to COVID-19, which we announced, made official and launched yesterday.
The net increase for the supplementary estimates (A) also includes $1.2 billion for out-of-court settlements to advance Canada's overall commitment to reconciliation by paving the way to a more respectful and constructive relationship with indigenous peoples.
It also includes $1.1 billion for child and family services to support a proactive agreement on a non-compliance motion before the CHRT. The funding is crucial. Since the CHRT issued its first order for Canada to cease its discriminatory practices in 2016, we have been working with first nations leaders and partners to implement the tribunal's orders, and we are in compliance. The $1.1 billion will go to communities that are engaged in activities that prevent the apprehension of kids and contribute to the transformation of the system that has been so broken.
Let me be clear once again. We share the same goal: First nations children historically harmed by the child welfare system will receive fair, just and equitable compensation. The government is not questioning or challenging the notion that compensation should be awarded to first nations children who were harmed by the historical discrimination and underfunding of the child welfare system. The question is not whether we compensate; it is a question of doing so in a way that is fair, equitable and inclusive of those directly impacted.
To this end, we have already consented to certification of the consolidated class action filed in the Federal Court by the Assembly of First Nations and Councillor Xavier Moushoom regarding the same children who were harmed by the system, as contemplated by the CHRT. Furthermore, we are currently in mediation with the partners, but as is set out in the mediation agreement, those discussions will remain confidential out of respect.
We remain committed to providing first nations children access to the necessary supports and services in partnership with indigenous peoples. To that effect, it's important to note that 820,000 claims under Jordan's principle have been processed since 2016, which represents close to $2 billion in funding.
Most notably, in January 2020, An Act respecting First Nations, Inuit and Métis children, youth and families came into force. It is key to this conversation in transforming the relationship, responding to the calls to action and setting a new way forward. Indigenous governments and communities have always had the inherent right to decide things that people like me take for granted; that is, what is best for their children, their families and their communities. The act provides a path for them to fully exercise and lift up that jurisdiction.
As a result of this work led by indigenous communities, two indigenous laws have now come into force under the federal law, the Wabaseemoong Independent Nations law in Ontario and the Cowessess First Nation Miyo Pimatisowin Act in Saskatchewan. In each of these communities, children will have greater opportunity to grow up and thrive immersed in their culture and surrounded by loved ones.
I will now move on to an update on COVID-19.
Throughout the pandemic, and still today, Indigenous Services Canada has been aware of the particular vulnerability of indigenous communities to the virus.
From the outset, we knew that immediate, decisive measures were necessary to protect the communities as best we could. Our absolute priority was the safety, health and well-being of the First Nations, the Inuit and the Métis.
However, without the dedication and determination of all of the leaders of those communities, none of that would have been possible. I want to thank them for their continuous work over the last year, in particular in encouraging the members of their communities to get vaccinated.
With respect to vaccine roll-out, as of June 7, 687 indigenous communities had campaigns underway. In total, that corresponds to 540,581 doses administered, including first and second doses.
This means that 41% of eligible people aged 12 and over in the communities or living in the territories have received two doses of the vaccine. This is crucial in the communities where the population is predominantly young.
In addition, 80% of people have received a first dose, and if we consider those aged 12 and over, we are talking about 72%. So this is tremendous progress.
With respect to the number of cases, as of June 9, in First Nations communities, we are aware of 761 active cases, which is, fortunately, a decline from the previous week. That brings us now to just about 30,568 confirmed cases of COVID-19. Of those, 29,459 people have recovered, and, tragically, 348 others have died.
I see that perhaps that you're flagging me, Bob, or do I have a couple of minutes?
View Gary Vidal Profile
CPC (SK)
I'm sorry. I have so much that I want to do here quickly.
You spoke about child and family services. I think you referenced a couple of first nations that have completed that journey or are moving down that journey of taking over their responsibilities. I've asked you this question before, and maybe that is a simple answer.
Are there so far just two first nations that have indicated their desire to do that? Just where are we at in that process? Based on some of the events of the last few weeks here, I think it's so very important that we deal with some of the current issues as well, and having first nations control of some of their child and family services is important. I'm just wondering how fast that is happening.
If you could briefly respond, I want to get into one more detailed question, if I could.
View Marc Miller Profile
Lib. (QC)
Yes, and I'll be quite frank: It's slow. Certainly, the pandemic, where people have focused on their health and safety of the communities has resulted in a slowdown. This is a revolutionary piece of legislation that lifts up inherent rights of indigenous peoples. We have dozens and dozens of communities across Canada that have expressed interest. There was about $500 million or more in the fall economic statement that was dedicated to working on capacity, to putting those laws forward and entrenching them.
We want to make sure that we have proper coordination agreements in place with provinces that hold the bulk of that responsibility. There's a relationship aspect there with the provinces, including your home province, that we can't discount in all of this, but there are many more.... There are some that have lifted up their own legislation and have said, “We're not necessarily interested in Bill C-92, but this is how we're going to protect our children.” That has some validity as well.
We're very cautious in those estimates, but I would say for the benefit of this committee that there are dozens and dozens that have done good work along the way. There are some difficult challenges ahead in and around capacity, so I won't hide that from you, but it is a long road, and it is part and parcel of everything we've seen in the last week.
View Adam van Koeverden Profile
Lib. (ON)
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I will have two questions for the minister. I would start by asking him to answer the first one, and to leave enough time to answer the second.
First, in January 2020, An Act respecting First Nations, Inuit and Métis children, youth and families came into effect to affirm the jurisdiction of indigenous communities over child and family services. How will this act support the well-being of indigenous children and families and provide culturally relevant care to children? Could you please provide an update on the implementation of this act?
View Marc Miller Profile
Lib. (QC)
What we've seen throughout, and particularly what has become quite poignant and top of mind over the last week, is that Canada and the provinces have been administering a broken system for some time. We can talk about compensation, which is very important. When we talk about transformation, that's when we have to talk about the legislation that was passed just before the prior election. It's shifting, in the spirit of self-determination, a system that was focused on prevention, and not culturally appropriate, to one that is...or rather, from intervention to prevention. When it's embodied and ensconced in the language of self-determination, it is an effort to lift up communities in how they protect their own—again, something we've taken for granted.
It is long work. It requires an intense amount of consultation. There was about $500 million in the fall economic statement dedicated to building capacity. That's something that will be deployed over five years. Additional investments will be required as communities bring home their children and pass their legislation to lift it up.
When I said to Gary that it was slow, an important principle was embodied when the law came into force—the minimum standard of the child. It is a signal to all of Canada and to courts that they can no longer sanction practices that removed disproportionately indigenous children from their families based on such issues as poverty. That is still the challenge for every single government in the future, to keep combatting a poverty discrimination that is the legacy of our colonial past.
Wilton Littlechild
View Wilton Littlechild Profile
Wilton Littlechild
2021-06-03 12:07
I was acknowledging and thanking you for this great, although very sad, moment for you to call a special session where we can recognize and uplift the spirit of the child's life, which in our culture is very important.
[Witness spoke in Cree]
[English]
My name is Walking Wolf, from the Maskwacis Cree territory, and I want to thank you again, first of all, for calling this special session.
I want to draw us right back to the first report that the commission made. We concluded very early, from the stories we were hearing, that this was a direct assault. The indigenous residential school policy or the Indian residential school policy was an assault on our languages, on our families, on our communities and, very importantly, on our spirituality. I want to talk about that in terms of the impact of this finding on families and communities from the perspective of not only our traditional laws, our customary laws, but also our sacred laws, especially in terms of our practice when we lose someone in our community.
I want to begin with a story about my own grandfather, Mahihgan Pimoteyw, whose name I bear now. In a epidemic, when he was a chief, he had to bury 33 members of the Ermineskin Cree Nation in one day. That obligation was passed down to my mother, and then now to me, to help our community at times of grief and mourning like we have today.
Also, I wanted to remind us that in our history we saw many gravesites, during our journey as a commission, that were outside the graveyard, because the person may have been a young person from the school who had committed suicide, and they were not allowed to be buried within the graveyard. I want to point that out also, because when I was in residential school—three of them for over 14 years—when I was 10 and 12 I lost both of my grandparents, who actually were the ones who raised me, but I was not allowed to go to their funeral. I didn't have a chance to say farewell to my grandmother or my grandfather. Now I do, through this opportunity.
The other thing I want to point out is as a commission we always had an empty seat beside us, and I have an empty seat beside me now. We would call in the child's spirit to come and join us at the hearing, to guide us, to pray with us and just to be with us to support us. Then, after the hearing, we will send the spirit free again, back to the place of forever happiness, as our old people often call it.
I want to also reflect on our own repatriation here of 17 bodies from a residential school. All that was marked on the coffin was “nine-year-old girl” or “12-year-old boy”. There was one particular one that had “6-year-old boy”, and I chose to carry that coffin to the graveyard after our ceremonies, because that's how old I was when I was taken to residential school.
We had a traditional ceremony. By that I mean we had a wake. We sang our 16 travelling songs. We had our pipe ceremony. We had our elders speak to us during the wake, and also we had our last giveaway feast. These are traditional ceremonies that are not only ceremonies but a part of our laws. We need to do this as indigenous people when we lose someone from our community. The hardest one is always when you lose a child. We were able to do that. After that, we had a memorial for four years after the burial, on the day of the burial.
I wanted to mention that this was lost to these families of 215 children and more. In my own community, there were the 17 I mentioned. Also, there were four little skeletons that were found in the old school when it was being taken down, so it hits home for me, because our school at one time was also the largest in Canada, with over 500 students from all different parts of the province.
I want to thank the leaders here in my community—the elders who had a memorial service. We've been having prayer ceremonies every day since we heard this news, because one of the Mayan prophecies is that spirituality has to come back to leadership. I mention that one of the four prophecies they made recently.
I want to thank Deputy Minister Quan-Watson, because I know the previous witness, and he follows this with respect, the teaching, in his work.
In conclusion, I want to remind us of the sacred teachings, and in this case the one I want to reflect on is one about respect. I heard it earlier in the session that this must be community led. Yesterday I was engaged with the United Nations conference on the coming decade for indigenous languages. As you know, that was one of the ones that was assaulted as well.
In saying that, the suggestion was made that this not be indigenous led but indigenous driven, because the difference between the two words is that if it's indigenous driven, then you have a hand in it and can shape the outcomes that you desire in a good way. We need to respect that teaching, as well.
[Witness spoke in Cree]
[English]
Continue the good work you are doing, and as I did in our community, I ask for everyone who is listening to pause for a moment and say a prayer for these children who now have a bright path going back to the sacred place of the ancestors.
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. That's all I wanted to present at this point.
Marie Wilson
View Marie Wilson Profile
Marie Wilson
2021-06-03 12:31
Thank you very much, Chair.
Good morning, everyone. I want to acknowledge the committee and, if I may say, Chair Bratina, I also honour your expressions of remorse and what you shared with us about your wife in a very personal conversation. I think that speaks to our shared humanity as we come round this issue.
I want to acknowledge Deputy Minister Quan-Watson as well for [Technical difficulty—Editor] coming to you from Treaty 8 territory [Technical difficulty—Editor] peoples of the Dene Nation. I know Daniel lived here, but he also worked with us and paid attention to us throughout the work of our commission.
I also want to acknowledge my fellow commissioners. Good morning to you both. It's good to see you both. Thank you very much, Chief Littlechild, for your very personal sharings as well.
I acknowledge our NCTR relatives. I refer to them in that way because, in speaking of them, the existence of the National Centre for Truth and Reconciliation was something that our commission gave birth to. It was part of our mandate with the Truth and Reconciliation Commission, and they carry on the very important and reverent work of safekeeping all that we learned and all that was given to us by way of teachings and material effects during the commission's work.
I also want to acknowledge any survivors or intergenerational survivors who may be in the room, on this committee or joining us in other ways and whose voices and, I have to say, relentless advocacy and efforts have brought us to this time and place.
Finally, and most particularly, I want to acknowledge and honour all those across the country who are grieving and who are, at the same time, feeling expressions of feeling validated for all that they have told us and all that is beginning to be heard.
I was thinking, if only I could say happy anniversary, but we're not here to celebrate. Rather, we're here to hold up to the light those things that, in fact, we have known about for years but have until now denied, ignored, or given insufficient attention, resources, or the urgency needed for action to follow.
What was happening six years ago today—six years ago, exactly, yesterday? In fact, thousands of residential school survivors and others from throughout the land were gathered in Ottawa to witness, receive and celebrate the conclusions of the Truth and Reconciliation Commission of Canada. We three commissioners stood together to release the summary report of our findings, a full volume of survivors' voices—some of whom talked precisely about this issue—10 founding principles of reconciliation and 94 calls to action. We have today referenced only the calls to action numbering in the 70s, which are particularly about this, but there are others calls to action that are interrelated, such as number 82, which calls for a national monument, in part to have a commemorative place for the unknown child—those who we haven't yet found and may never find.
My part in those final speeches that day was, in fact, about the missing children. We talked about it a lot at that time, and that was six years ago.
A few months later, we released our multi-volume, full report, and our chair, Mr. Sinclair, has just referred you to volume 4, an entire volume devoted to missing children and unmarked burials.
Commissioner Littlechild has talked to you about the chairs we had in place, the empty chairs, usually two of them, one for all the little boys and one for all the little girls, so they would be ever present in front of mind in our thinking and in our work.
The conclusions in our reports did not come from thin air. They came from historic documents, from new research that was commissioned by us and from 7,000 recorded voices of former residential school student survivors, each one of them an expert on their own lived experiences, what happened to them, what happened to friends and family members, what they witnessed and those they never saw again.
Well, that was six years ago. What was happening nine years ago? In public hearings open to all who cared to pay attention, because all of our activities were public and most of them web-streamed, survivor women in Chisasibi, northern Quebec, entrusted me with this baby rattle, the shiishiikun. They conveyed a particular responsibility to me as the woman commissioner, sometimes referred to as the mother commissioner, to do all that we could to find and free the spirits of the missing children.
What was happening 11 years ago? At one of our very earliest TRC events, in Winnipeg, we sat in a circle, which included the then Conservative Minister of Aboriginal Affairs and a former chief, who implored us to find their missing relative, one who had never returned home from residential school.
What was happening 13 years ago? Leaders from each and every one of your political parties stood in the House of Commons to offer official apologies for your parties' and for respective governments' roles in imposing and perpetuating the residential school system. Very importantly, each one promised to work together to make things right in the spirit of reconciliation.
We are called together again today in what you have deemed an emergency session. I've been pondering this question: When does the known, when does the atrocious become an emergency? I'm very, very grateful for this expression of urgency but I am dismayed that it's being framed using the poor language that we have to work with, that it's being called “discovery of human remains”. This is not a discovery, which is why I have reminded you of this history. It is the validation of all that we have previously and repeatedly been told and have been saying. These are not statistics. We know the number, but these are not statistics. By the way, these are also not all of the children we know to have died at school. We already knew of 52 in our existing records. These are not statistics; these are little children, some of them possibly now forever unknown but all of them loved and none of them ever forgotten.
What can Canada do?
I've tried to wrap my head around what we might offer back as you go forward with your deliberations. Commissioner Sinclair touched on it already, and I think it's extremely important. First is a continued and sustained non-partisan response and prioritization of resources needed to do this work and all that is being addressed under that broad banner of reconciliation. We have repeatedly said that reconciliation is a non-partisan issue.
Next is accountability, so that we hold ourselves as a country to the international standards and expectations that we would in fact, and we have in the past, advocated for with respect to other countries, including in terms of the consideration of crime and crimes against humanity.
I would ask for honest language and that we not make ourselves comfortable with phrases such as “a sad chapter in our history”. Is it that or is it a human rights atrocity? Is it a social policy mistake or, in this story, was it a breeding ground for crime and abuse? With my appreciation for your committee, your focus and your commitment, for which I'm very grateful, I want you to push for this to be seen more and more as not just an issue for indigenous and northern affairs. It is an issue of human rights and of justice that is of critical importance to all Canadians and to our very principles of democracy.
It is for all of government, and I would say all of governments, as we say repeatedly in our calls to action, and the federal government with its particular ability and influence and powers to convene across all governments. Call to action number 75 in particular is very specific about that. Many of these residential schools and the burial sites are no longer on church-owned properties or even public properties. Many of them are now in private hands, and there's going to be a need for collaboration among private landowners, municipalities, indigenous leaders, provincial governments and territorial ones as well.
Then I would ask for transparency and comprehensive reporting, and, of course, that flows most easily when you have a comprehensive strategy that has been communicated and that we all know about. That way, we can know what progress is being made without having to depend on the government purporting to have done things without anyone else being well aware of them.
I am aware, in fact, of the initiatives that are under way within the indigenous affairs department on this file. Has it advanced enough? Has it advanced fast enough? Are people aware of its existence?
I think these are things we need to communicate thoroughly, frequently and in a comprehensive way, so we understand how these efforts tie in with the other efforts that are all intertwined in our calls to action. I really encourage you and all others not to limit yourselves to the calls to action that number in the 70s.
Act on the obvious. As an example, take number 82, which is outside that bundle in the 70s. It calls for a national monument to honour all students who went to residential schools, knowing that it also is intended to serve as the tomb of the unknown child, if you will, and accepting, as we must, that not all the children we will find will ever be identified. Will we ever know exactly where they came from and who they belonged to?
I would like to end by saying that I would like us to embrace—without making crass comparisons—the valuable lessons of COVID, where we have shown and proven to ourselves that we know how to give urgent response. We know how to do whatever it takes, whatever it costs, when it has to do with the right thing, when it has to do with us taking care of each other, and when it has to do with making sure we are living up to the standards we say we believe in as a country.
I want to end, if I may, where I began, by honouring all the generations of little ones who were taken from their homes and displaced from everything and everyone they knew, and by acknowledging the little children lying in Kamloops. This past week they have risen up and they have begun to be heard across the country. They have brought Canada to the forefront of international attention. It's our responsibility collectively, I think, to continue to listen to them and to make every effort to find the others throughout the land who are still missing.
I look forward to your questions and conversation. Thank you very much.
Marsi cho.
Stephanie Scott
View Stephanie Scott Profile
Stephanie Scott
2021-06-03 12:44
I'll start. I just want to begin by acknowledging that I'm joining this meeting from the original lands of the Anishinabe, Cree, Oji-Cree, Dakota and Dene peoples, in the homeland of the Métis.
On behalf of the National Centre for Truth and Reconciliation, I want to say thank you, meegwetch, to the commissioners, whom I was able to walk beside for many years during the commission. I want to thank the honourable chair and the members of the committee for initiating this timely and absolutely necessary study.
My heart goes out to the families of the children who perished at the Kamloops residential school, and all the children who did not return home. This is a time of mourning. It is also an opportunity to finally do the work to locate the children who were taken away, never to return home.
It's our sincere hope that what the Tk’emlúps te Sekwépemc have accomplished in locating 215 children will be a moment where all Canadians embrace the truth and act with genuine commitment towards reconciliation. We hope that out of this tragedy, we will see a concerted national action to locate and honour all first nations, Métis and Inuit children who perished as a result of the residential school system. This is something that is urgently needed and long overdue.
As the former manager of statement gathering during the Truth and Reconciliation Commission, I heard survivors talk about witnessing the murder and death of children when they were at residential schools. Many parents were never notified of their child's passing, nor told where their children were. We continue to hear these accounts at the National Centre for Truth and Reconciliation. The fourth volume of the TRC's final report described cemeteries as being abandoned and unprotected.
The NCTR is the child of the TRC, and we continue to work closely with survivors to ensure our work is guided by their vision and reflects their truth. Five of the 94 calls to action call on governments and Canadian institutions to collaborate with and support our ongoing work.
Call to action 72 specifically calls on the federal government to allocate sufficient resources to the NCTR to allow us to maintain the national residential school student death register. Between the work of the TRC and the NCTR, we have confirmed 4,117 deaths of children in the residential schools. Due to gaps in the records, we have not been able to identify the names of some of these children.
The number of children believed to have gone missing is much higher. Record-keeping for these schools was nowhere near today's standards, nor were the records consistent. Review of the records already in the NCTR's collection is still ongoing, and we will find more children.
A significant key in piecing together the evidence remains with survivors and their families. Even today, survivors continue to come forward with accounts of deaths that they witnessed. Many are in unmarked graves. There are also accounts of bodies that were buried within walls, bodies buried in the hills or by riversides, and bodies that were never found after children died trying to escape from these schools. These sites are in fact crime scenes, and the discovery at Kamloops has triggered a new urgency for survivors and their families to share their truths while they still can.
We do not know what communities will decide concerning repatriating children to their homes. This must be the choice of families and communities. I do, however, want to underscore to the committee the urgency of documenting what survivors witnessed or what families have shared about missing loved ones. We are racing against time. We often hear from survivors that they have fewer tomorrows than they have yesterdays.
We know the Kamloops residential school is one school in over 140 across this country. We are only at the beginning of recognizing the extent of the horrific loss of precious lives. The work ahead is extensive.
I feel it is also important for the committee to recognize that, at this point, there is no ongoing federal commitment to maintain the NCTR's core funding, which is necessary for this vital work to continue.
Since we opened in 2015, we have developed a national student memorial register, created internships with other institutions to expand digital archives, and created greater accessibility of the truths within the records we hold. We also developed a commemoration and healing fund with the guidance of residential school survivors. In developing this fund, survivors prioritized accessibility, because communities deserve to pursue healing and remembrance in ways they feel are appropriate for themselves, without red tape and cumbersome bureaucratic barriers.
I will now ask Dr. Cynthia Wesley-Esquimaux, the chair of the NCTR's governing circle, to talk about what needs to be done going forward.
Meegwetch.
View James Maloney Profile
Lib. (ON)
I looked at the definition, and I don't see that a child of somebody who is in prison, who has committed a crime, would fall under the definition of victim. However, if you're talking about things like parole hearings and the benefits available and access to information, there are situations where children have parents who have committed crimes of whatever nature and who are now suffering through no fault of their own.
Anybody can answer this question. Would you think it's a good idea that they be incorporated into the definition of victim somehow?
Julie Thompson
View Julie Thompson Profile
Julie Thompson
2021-06-03 11:49
If I could, I will attempt to offer some information in response to this question. While I can't offer an opinion on whether or not the definition should be adjusted to include children, I did want to offer that there are some information publications available to children who have parents who are being incarcerated. Not to put my colleague from Correctional Services on the spot, I've forgotten the name of the organization that provides that service. I'd be happy to provide it, but I'm wondering if Correctional Services might....
View James Maloney Profile
Lib. (ON)
Are there structures in place that do work with the children of perpetrators? Is that along the same lines as might be considered under the Victims Bill of Rights?
Kirstan Gagnon
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Kirstan Gagnon
2021-06-03 11:50
They do, yes.
Amilcar Kraudie
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Amilcar Kraudie
2021-05-11 18:50
Thank you, and good evening.
I am Amilcar Kraudie, humanitarian adviser at Save the Children Canada. I am here with my colleague Taryn Russell, the head of policy and advocacy.
My comments today will be through the lens of Save the Children's experience working to address children's needs and rights in humanitarian development settings for more than 100 years.
Every year, Save the Children responds to close to 80 emergencies across 120 countries. We have been working to reach children affected by the war in Syria since 2012. We provide emergency and life-saving support, combined with early recovery activities that help restore basic services for children and their families. We welcome this opportunity to brief you on our key concerns for children in northern Syria and Turkey based on our work in this region.
The Syrian crisis for us is fundamentally first and foremost a protection crisis. More than 10 years of conflict continues to have a devastating impact on children inside Syria, as well as those displaced to neighbouring countries. Every child in Syria has been impacted by the ongoing violence and displacement. Violations of children's rights by all parties to the conflict continue, to varying degrees.
The convergence of conflict, COVID-19 and its control measures, and the seeming collapse of the Syrian currency are having profound effects on food security, education and other markers of well-being. Children's mental well-being is an increasing concern, as we are now seeing children resorting to taking their own lives. Almost one in five of all recorded suicide attempts and deaths in northwest Syria are children. The last three months of 2020 saw an 86% jump in suicide rates from the beginning of the year. These figures emerge among constantly deteriorating conditions for people in northwest Syria, including a substantial increase in the impact of COVID-19, poverty, a lack of education and employment, domestic violence, child marriages, broken relationships and bullying, all these in communities that have been reeling from a decade of conflict.
Mental health support is just one of the escalating needs we are seeing in northern Syria. It is estimated that 3.4 million people in northwest Syria alone are in need of humanitarian assistance and remain in areas outside of government control, only reachable with life-saving cross-border assistance. This cross-border assistance through the Bab al-Hawa crossing point in northern Idlib will only become more important, as it is needed to support COVID-19 vaccination efforts. First shipments of the vaccine were received a few weeks ago. Without cross-border access, vaccination efforts in northwest Syria will be all but impossible.
We are particularly concerned about the impact this latest increase and accompanying lockdown will have on children, including the thousands of children who are detained in northeast Syria in camps and other detention settings because of links to ISIS. In the largest camp, al-Hawl, 43,000 out of its 65,000 total population are children. Because of COVID-19 lockdowns and curfews, they are less likely able to access medical services and facilities affecting their health, education and mental well-being. This crisis is made much worse by the closure of the Al Yarubiyah border crossing point last year, cutting off all vital supplies, including medicine and food, from the most vulnerable people, including children. There is no justification for preventing life-saving supplies from reaching people in need, particularly during a global pandemic.
On top of all of that, we do want to highlight that there is also now an increased concern around water scarcity and how that is also impacting multiple needs across the board.
Recognizing the deteriorating situation in northern Syria and escalating humanitarian needs, we offer the following recommendations for the Government of Canada.
First, it is imperative that life-saving aid continues to reach millions in need in northwest Syria, and the UN Security Council should, at a minimum, renew cross-border access through Bab al-Hawa for at least 12 months. The Government of Canada should use any diplomatic influence to ensure this happens.
Second, the international community should also recognize the escalating humanitarian needs in the country and increase humanitarian funding accordingly. It is shameful that the pledging conference for Syria fell so short of its target. This gap needs to be rectified urgently. We are grateful that Canada stepped up and did not cut funding like other donors; however, additional funds could support some of the urgent mental health needs I discussed earlier.
The situations in the camps in northeast Syria are challenging, and the camps are no place for children to grow up. Putting even COVID-19 aside, we regularly see children die or being injured by accidents. It is estimated that 9,000 foreign children are in the region, including about 25 Canadian children, so for our third recommendation, we urge the Government of Canada to increase its efforts to identify the most appropriate routes for repatriation in line with the best interests of the child.
Thank you for your time today.
View Anita Vandenbeld Profile
Lib. (ON)
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. I will split my time with Mr. Sidhu.
I thank all the witnesses for their incredible expertise and testimony today, much of it very startling.
I did have some questions, but I want to start by following up on something that Mr. Kraudie said in his testimony. I've been on this committee for a number of years. I've worked in international development all over the world in some of the most dangerous places, but I've never heard about children committing suicide, which is incredibly alarming to me. I think you mentioned something like.... I can't remember the statistic, but can you elaborate on that? That is something I don't think we have very often heard in situations like this. Could you tell us what is causing that and what we can do about it?
Amilcar Kraudie
View Amilcar Kraudie Profile
Amilcar Kraudie
2021-05-11 19:02
Perhaps allow me to expand, going back to that issue, on how we recognize at Save the Children that the fact that Syria has been in conflict for 10 years reflects on the wider international community.
As you might imagine, that has a long-term and protracted impact on the well-being of children themselves. That's the first point, which is that there has been no end to the plight, and you can imagine how this happening day in and day out deepens their trauma.
The second point is a salient issue that we've picked up on. It is that Syrian children, even overseas in different locations, also voice that they simply don't want to return to Syria, because for them it evokes images of horror and further trauma.
The whole concept of post-traumatic stress disorder that these children are facing in the coming generations is fairly significant, and we at Save the Children want to put that at the forefront of the durable solutions this specific group needs. Especially when we're talking about durable solutions for the Syrian population, this angle or this element of mental health and psychosocial support is absolutely critical.
Taryn Russell
View Taryn Russell Profile
Taryn Russell
2021-05-11 19:03
I can add that one of the reasons for the recent jump is the surge of COVID cases and the associated lockdowns, which means children are out of school, which is often a safe space. Mental health is really affected by that, as we see here in Canada. Lockdowns, as well as the impact of COVID, also limit the ability of organizations to deliver mental health supports. That's one of the reasons for the recent surge in the last few months.
Thank you.
View Kenny Chiu Profile
CPC (BC)
Thank you. Perhaps you could submit some information on that to the committee.
Media reports indicate that at least 25 innocent Canadian children are trapped in refugee camps not far from Turkey, and the country is launching a military offensive. Is any witness attending the meeting today familiar with the situation of Canadian children in Syria in that part of the world? I have 30 seconds left.
Farida Deif
View Farida Deif Profile
Farida Deif
2021-05-11 19:17
I'm sorry, but I think you mean the same Canadian children we were speaking about earlier, because the number is exactly the same.
We know that a remaining 24 Canadian children whose family members have ties to ISIS are detained by the Kurdish-led authorities in northeast Syria, the de facto authority there.
View Kenny Chiu Profile
CPC (BC)
View Heather McPherson Profile
NDP (AB)
In your opinion, is Canada, at this point, in contravention of, for example, the rights of the child?
Fionnuala Ní Aoláin
View Fionnuala Ní Aoláin Profile
Fionnuala Ní Aoláin
2021-05-11 19:26
Canada and all of the other 57 states that have failed to repatriate their nationals are in clear breach of the Convention on the Rights of the Child, and the Committee on the Rights of the Child has explicitly found on this issue, not specific to Canada but in relation to other nationals, that the continued arbitrary detention of children in these camps is a breach of the convention.
View Patricia Lattanzio Profile
Lib. (QC)
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
My next two questions will be for Mr. Landry, but before getting to those questions, I'd like to ask him to send us copies of the two articles he mentioned in his reply to my colleague.
Here's my first question, Mr. Landry: what do you think are the vitality factors on which the OLMCs and the various orders of government should rely in establishing a community base for intergenerational language transmission?
Rodrigue Landry
View Rodrigue Landry Profile
Rodrigue Landry
2021-04-22 16:09
I've written extensively on that subject, and I think early childhood is the leading factor. For example, I've heard from many spokespersons for various organizations. Mr. Forgues has written extensively on the interests that each association advocates. Some authors discuss neo-corporate interests, for example. In fact, all organizations want money so they can advance their own sectors. On the other hand, they don't agree on the importance of early childhood or, in particular, on increasing parent awareness in order then to encourage them to enrol their children in minority schools. However, everyone would benefit if we could really emphasize that. In overall terms, only 50% of the children of francophone minority communities attend French-language schools, although that figure comes from Statistics Canada's 2006 post-census survey on the vitality of official language minorities.
Consequently, I feel that the crucial factors are early childhood and education. Many encouraging points are also made in the white paper, which I recently read but hadn't read before I finished writing my article. It outlines some interesting aspects and, from what I understood, seems to single out early childhood.
View Patricia Lattanzio Profile
Lib. (QC)
Would you please send us the most recent study as well as the one from 2008 or 2009?
Second, I want to ask if you could tell us about the specific issues that exogamous families face. In that particular context, what are the consequences for the transmission of the minority language to the children of those families? What are the trends in their educational and linguistic path?
Rodrigue Landry
View Rodrigue Landry Profile
Rodrigue Landry
2021-04-22 16:12
Exogamy is a very interesting phenomenon. Take school enrolment, for example. Approximately 34% of exogamous parents in francophone minority situations send their children to francophone schools, compared to 88% of families where both parents are francophone. So you might believe that the entire burden rests on the shoulders of exogamous parents. However, our more in-depth analyses show that exogamy is the direct cause of failure to transmit the French language or to enrol children in francophone schools. Exogamy is a factor that influences the family language dynamic.
I like to compare exogamous families to the federal government. An exogamous family is a microcosm of society. In both cases, people have to learn to value both languages within the same unit. Politicians have to do it in Parliament, and parents in exogamous families have to do it with members of their own family. That's how I view the federal government's role, which is to increase awareness among parents. All parents want their children to be bilingual, but our surveys show that very few parents actually understand the issues involved. So-called additive bilingualism, which is acquired when you learn a second language without losing your first, is always better when you focus on the weaker language.
View René Arseneault Profile
Lib. (NB)
Thank you, Mr. Landry.
My next question is for Mr. Landry or Mr. Forgues.
You spoke earlier about community bases and the intergenerational transmission of the language. Which of the vitality factors should our OLMCs focus on? What should the different levels of government do to solidify this base?
Rodrigue Landry
View Rodrigue Landry Profile
Rodrigue Landry
2021-04-22 17:29
We have an action plan on official languages, but we have no plan for communicating with the main stakeholders, who are the parents. During my short introductory remarks, I mentioned that one of the factors that has been contributing to poor communication is that we are neglecting the main players. The federal government should keep parents informed.
Research has indisputably shown that when the emphasis is placed on the weaker language, children become extremely bilingual. We educate 80% of children in French and their English is as proficient as that of anglophones. They therefore become more bilingual. Parents need to be informed of this.
David Morin
View David Morin Profile
David Morin
2021-04-14 17:52
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and members of the committee. Good afternoon.
As my colleague, Laura Farquharson, indicated, my name is David Morin. I am the director general of the safe environments directorate at Health Canada.
I welcome this opportunity to discuss Health Canada's role in protecting the health of Canadians from environmental risks.
Specifically, I would like to spend the next few minutes speaking to Health Canada's activities related to the health of indigenous peoples and racialized communities and the environmental health risks they face. This includes risks associated with exposure to toxic chemicals, air pollution and water pollution.
Exposure to toxic chemicals represents an ongoing health risk facing indigenous peoples and racialized communities, as well as other vulnerable populations.
In response, Health Canada has been working to better integrate specific considerations for vulnerable populations when conducting chemical risk assessments and implementing risk management activities under the Canadian Environmental Protection Act. These improvements include the establishment of a vulnerable populations panel to help better understand the real-life exposures of vulnerable populations to chemicals.
In parallel with these efforts, Health Canada has also undertaken science and research initiatives targeting the environmental health risks facing Canada's indigenous populations. For example, Health Canada, in partnership with the Nishnawbe Aski Nation as well as Indigenous Services Canada and other partners, recently completed the Sioux Lookout zone children's environmental health study.
The multi-year study was undertaken to characterize indoor and outdoor air quality in first nations communities in Canada because of the high levels of respiratory illness, such as bronchitis and pneumonia, in children.
The study provides valuable insights into the linkages between housing, indoor air quality and health.
We now better understand the current state of housing in the Nishnawbe Aski Nation, but we also have a better understanding of issues related to air quality.
Finally, since 1991, Health Canada, along with other federal departments, has supported the northern contaminants program. The objective of this program is to reduce or eliminate contaminants in traditional foods and to provide information on contaminants to individuals and communities so they can better protect themselves. This program includes biomonitoring of contaminant levels in northern populations.
I wish to thank the committee for the opportunity to highlight examples of activities Health Canada has undertaken to address the environmental health risks faced by segments of the population.
Thank you very much for your attention.
Josh Berman
View Josh Berman Profile
Josh Berman
2021-04-13 16:03
Thank you.
Let me start by recognizing and thanking the federal government, MPs, and Canada's federal civil servants, for the critical and important work you are doing to support people living in Canada through this pandemic. Thank you.
I'm proud to represent today, along with Chad, from whom you'll hear in just a moment, our 84 clubs, which together serve more than 200,000 children and youth at over 775 locations across Canada. As one of Canada's largest child- and youth-serving organizations, our early learning and child care and our before- and after-school programs help young people develop into healthy, active and engaged adults.
Over the past 100 years and during these last 13 difficult months, our clubs have been there for vulnerable children, youth and families. Today clubs are providing food for families, partnering with their local food banks. We provide safe child care and programs for children and youth, and help to share trusted information on COVID safety and vaccines with our members. We have rolled out safe and high-quality digital programs when kids can't be in clubs.
Chad and I want to focus our remarks today on four key takeaways.
First, while the emergency community support fund allowed clubs to further step forward in the early months of the pandemic to support our communities, the needs in our communities continue to outstrip our ability to fully respond. Importantly, as the demand for our programs and services rises, it means more dollars out the door, not in.
Second, while the demand for our programs and services has risen, revenue has fallen. Our revenues across the country are down some $20 million after taking into account federal and other emergency supports due to large reductions in earned incomes and philanthropy. Programs like the Canadian employment wage subsidy have been extremely important in helping charities like BGC protect staff positions in the face of declining revenues. The extension of this program to June is positive and we support broad calls for further extension as the pandemic drags on.
Lastly, frontline human service charities are still facing serious fiscal challenges that have not been addressed by government programs to date, and are severely limiting our shared capacity to deliver services to communities that have borne the brunt of COVID-19's impact. A continued response to this crisis demands more. This is why we have joined others and continue our call for a community services COVID relief fund in next week's budget. This fund would provide a temporary, 18-month operating funding program to bridge our frontline agencies to the other side of this pandemic and support a transformation fund to help community services invest in their capacity, technology, operating models and mergers in order to come out of this pandemic stronger and more resilient.
We thank you, members of this committee, for your pre-budget recommendation for bridge operating grants for essential community human services organizations. These are organizations like ours that are run by and for those who serve Black, indigenous and people of colour, and are proud members of our shared economy, one that employs, I should say, 315,000 people across Canada. BGC has supported vulnerable community members for over 100 years and done so while balancing our books. This proposed fund wouldn't make us whole but would allow us to continue to provide child care and after-school programs, run safe transitional housing programs and offer newcomer support, virtual counselling and shelters for people experiencing homelessness and women fleeing domestic violence.
With that, let me pass it to Chad.
Chad Polito
View Chad Polito Profile
Chad Polito
2021-04-13 16:06
Thanks, Josh.
BGC Dawson is a community organization that has recently celebrated its 60th anniversary and serves over 800 families in the Montreal area.
The COVID-19 pandemic brought on some unique challenges for our community. Food security is one of our core programs. Pre-pandemic, we were serving 40 to 50 individuals per week through our food bank. At the height of the pandemic, this number skyrocketed to 941 people per month. While we are extremely grateful and thankful for the emergency community support fund, which enabled us to meet this need temporarily, we have more requests for food than we have resources. We had to make the difficult decision to scale back our food bank and are now serving just over 400 individuals each month, but the demand remains.
Summer camp, one of our key revenue-generating programs, was moved to a virtual format last summer and was offered free of charge. This significantly impacted our ability to meet our 2020 budget.
On top of that, our building is in desperate need of repair. This year, we invested over $100,000 in building maintenance and still have to plan to replace a leaking roof and an original furnace in order to be able to keep our doors open.
Our club, like others across Canada, had to make the difficult decision to lay off some staff and reduce program offerings. Approximately 70% of our staff nationwide are women, and we know that the services we provide allow mothers who so choose to enter and stay in the workforce.
Looking forward, we are committed to being there for our community and want to be in a strong position to adapt our programs to meet new realities. An article in the Financial Post on April 8 found that “the number of Canadians close to insolvency reached a five-year high”, with 53% of those polled saying that “they are $200 or less away from not being able to meet their bills and debt payments each month”.
We know that a lot of the families we serve are struggling financially and are just barely hanging on. As we move through this pandemic, organizations like ours need to be able to offer vital programs and services to all who need them, as part of our commitment to long-term community care.
Thank you for the opportunity to be here today.
Paul Champ
View Paul Champ Profile
Paul Champ
2021-03-11 15:39
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair, vice-chair and members of the committee. Thank you for this invitation.
I'm a human rights lawyer in Ottawa. I specialize in constitutional and international law. I've represented many Canadians detained abroad in a variety of different contexts. That's why I believe I've been invited to speak to you today.
I'm also going to discuss the issue that Mr. Mohammed just raised about the thousands of people who are held in Syria, in particular the 25 Canadian children who are being held in the two prison camps at al-Hol and Roj. We know there are 64,000 people in those camps, two-thirds of whom are children under 12, including those 25 Canadian children. UN investigators have described the conditions in these camps as appalling and inhumane.
Some humanitarian services have now been scaled back because of COVID. Workers from UNICEF and from MSF, Médecins Sans Frontières, have pulled back some of their services because some of their workers have contracted COVID in the camps.
The UN has also reported that many of these children are dying. They are dying from malnutrition, as well as dehydration, diarrhea and hypoglycemia. Their daily lives could not be more desperate were it not also for the violence in these camps. Exploitation and abuse is rife. People are killed by gunfire almost daily.
Committee members, I know you've heard about some of these dire reports. However, as a lawyer, I want to provide you with a different perspective. I want to advise you that in my legal opinion, Canada has a duty to take whatever measures are reasonably available to repatriate these Canadian citizens, especially the children. There can be no dispute that these children are being subjected to serious human rights abuses, such as arbitrary detention and cruel and inhumane treatment. The rights to life and security of the person are being jeopardized. There is also discrimination on a prohibited ground—nationality.
On that last one, the irony is that while Canada has not yet done anything for these individuals, those children are being detained now because they are Canadian citizens. Thousands of Syrians have been released from these camps, but foreigners and the children of foreigners continue to be held. Here's the tragic point in this: The Syrian defence forces want to release these Canadian children. Their condition: They want Canada to take them back. Unless and until Canada does so, they're going to continue to detain them indefinitely in these appalling and dangerous prison camps.
Canadian government officials will disagree with my legal opinion that's there's a duty on Canada to take action. They will say that the charter does not extend abroad and does not obligate the government to intervene to assist Canadians abroad in their efforts to leave a foreign country. In most contexts, I would agree with that, but I've been involved in other cases in which I've successfully compelled the Canadian government to return Canadian citizens to Canada when they were at risk of serious human rights abuse. That is the difference. Where Canada knows that a citizen abroad is at risk of a serious human rights abuse, such as torture or death, Canada can take measures. If it is within its power to diminish or alleviate that risk, the Charter of Rights and Freedoms is triggered.
That's the crucial point in this particular humanitarian crisis. When the SDF says that they will only release these Canadian children if Canada agrees to return them, it is Canada that holds the keys to those prison camps. It is within Canada's power, and therefore Canada's responsibility, to repatriate these Canadian children from prison camps in the conflict-affected area. I'm sure they will never admit it publicly—and I see some members perhaps shaking their head—but I'm sure some Canadian government officials know that I'm right, or believe that I'm right, and that Canada's legal duties in the circumstances include repatriating people at risk of serious human rights abuses.
I know this because when faced with a lawsuit from a family with an orphan, Amira, in October, Canada returned her.
I'll leave you with this: You can think of this another way. What if China said tomorrow that they would release the two Michaels, but only if Canada would agree to come and retrieve them? Do any of us here doubt that there would be wheels up on a CF plane to China within hours? However, these children have been waiting for years. Let's not forget that the two Michaels travelled to China as adults, knowingly. These children are innocent. They did not make the choice to travel to a war zone, yet it is in a war zone that they are trapped. They are completely innocent. Canada has the power to return them.
Thank you.
Alex Kamarotos
View Alex Kamarotos Profile
Alex Kamarotos
2021-03-11 15:44
Good afternoon.
Let me first of all thank you warmly for the invitation to Defence for Children International. I'll start with a few words about the organization. I think we are the only non-Canadians here.
Defence for Children International is a leading child rights-focused and membership-based grassroots movement and is currently composed of 35 national sections across five continents. It was created in 1979, the International Year of the Child, in Geneva, Switzerland.
The UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, Michelle Bachelet Jeria, reported the following at the current session of the UN Human Rights Council here in Geneva:
Much of the negative impact of the COVID-19 pandemic has been exacerbated by a failure to address previously existing structural causes of inequality, social exclusion and deprivation, and the inability of many countries, rich and poor alike, to meet the basic needs of a sizeable proportion of their populations.
This is equally applicable to children and the rights of the child, in particular during this pandemic. DCI has had the chance to count on some very relevant experience from such other health emergencies as the 2015 Ebola emergency in west Africa, where DCI-Sierra Leone and DCI-Liberia were particularly involved. In February 2020, the international secretariat and the entire movement mobilized in front of this pandemic. We very quickly gave alerts regarding the risk of violations exacerbated by the pandemic or even created by mitigation measures taken by states.
In my intervention, in complementarity with your earlier hearings, I want to touch upon two issues related to children. The first one concerns the impact of the pandemic on violence against children, including gender-based violence. The second is the impact on access to justice, in particular for children deprived of liberty. That touches upon the issue we just heard.
UNICEF reports that violence prevention and response services have been disrupted in 104 countries during the COVID pandemic. I believe we still only see the top of the iceberg regarding the impact of the COVID pandemic on violence against children, but it seems to be already well documented that COVID-19 and some of the mitigation measures taken by the governments have increased the exposure of children to different forms of violence, exacerbating such human rights violations as stigmatization, discrimination and xenophobia; child labour and unpaid work; child pregnancy; and harmful acts that include child marriage and female genital mutilation, as well as online abuse, bullying and exploitation. As the UN Special Representative of the Secretary-General on Violence Against Children emphasized in her report to the UN Human Rights Council earlier this week, “What began as a health crisis risks evolving into a broader child-rights crisis.”
I also want to share our experience and results in the area of justice for children, in particular children deprived of liberty. DCI has been part of the origin—we are currently the co-chair together with Human Rights Watch—of a wide civil society coalition on children deprived of liberty. The NGO Panel for the Global Study on Children Deprived of Liberty is composed of 170 civil society organizations worldwide. The UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, Michelle Bachelet Jeria, has urged authorities since the beginning of the pandemic to look at releasing detainees and in particular low-risk child offenders. UNICEF data indicate that at least 31 countries have released children from detention because of concerns about the spread of COVID-19. This is certainly insufficient, and even lower than the number of adult detainees released.
Honourable members, I cannot finish this very short and certainly incomplete presentation without speaking about the impact of COVID-19 measures on the mental health of children and the importance of ensuring the meaningful participation of children on mitigation measures that concern them. Last year DCI organized child- and youth-led online debates on the impacts of COVID-19. We had very, very concrete results.
We also participated, together with a great number of other civil society organizations, in #CovidUnder19, an initiative to meaningfully involve children in responses to the pandemic, with participation from more than 26,000 children from 137 countries.
I want to quote from two of the children who participated in the initiative. The first one comes from a Bolivian girl: “I think the government should understand that children are not dumb and easily manipulated. Children should feel that trust and not feel like they have to remain silent. This would increase their confidence and [motivate them] to report injustice.”
Last but not least, a 16-year-old Canadian girl said, “Even though there is a pandemic going on, there are people out there who experience abuse daily. The awareness, even in Canada, on how to access the resources is not explained in the best way. Finding that information should be basic knowledge for any human being.”
I thank you.
Geoff Loane
View Geoff Loane Profile
Geoff Loane
2021-03-11 15:50
Mr. Chairman, vice-chairs and committee members, on behalf of the International Committee of the Red Cross, I would like to express my gratitude for this opportunity to discuss this extremely important subject.
The role of the ICRC is mandated by the international community through the Geneva conventions, and our exclusively humanitarian role is to support the faithful application of international humanitarian law, and where appropriate, to support the protection and assistance of victims of armed conflict while respecting the core principles of humanity, neutrality and independence.
The impact of COVID-19 on the vulnerability of children in conflict-affected contexts is being felt and witnessed today throughout the world, and we will certainly see the outcome for years to come. It is a privilege to be able to share some of our own observations over the past 12 months. They must be taken as only preliminary observations, as the full impact of this pandemic has yet to be felt.
I would like to summarize my remarks into the following areas: education, detention, family links services, and recruitment by and association of children with armed forces and armed groups.
Education, by its nature, is the public service most vulnerable to shocks. That came tragically home to all of us in the space of a week in March 2020, when nearly two billion children in more than 185 countries stopped going to school and schools were closed. While many countries were able to adapt and respond with alternative learning platforms, the technical means are simply unavailable in most of the countries in which the ICRC is operational.
Because of school closures, children have been denied an opportunity to be learners and to make choices for themselves, and for many, a return to school is now precluded. Some have been forced into the workplace, some into early marriage and some into becoming homemakers. For the most vulnerable children in areas where the ICRC works, children who are displaced, refugees, in detention or simply relying on education as a protective mechanism in a conflict zone, perhaps to avoid recruitment by an armed group or perhaps to be able to eat one meal a day, the long-term impact of this school closure is likely to be catastrophic.
Last, we remain very concerned about the reported increase in levels of domestic violence, including the exposure of children to higher levels than previously recorded.
In places of detention, we have seen both positive and negative changes to the status quo. In some contexts, we have witnessed the positive impact of increased engagement by the authorities to review individual cases. In many different countries, there was an initial rapid release of detainees, often starting with children, as part of the efforts to free up space inside places of detention and to reduce the risks of infection for detainees. In some settings, COVID-19 has accelerated a judicial review process, whereas before COVID there was no particular urgency to look into the detention of children who may have been awaiting trial, had been detained without charge or already had served their sentence without yet being released.
However, on the other side, unfortunately, for children and indeed all detainees who remain in detention, COVID-19 has also meant the limiting of family visits, and therefore often the cutting off of valuable lifelines for children who both need and want to maintain contact with their loved ones, and more pragmatically, to receive food, clothing and medicine.
Across the world, COVID-19 has led to the closure of international borders, restriction of movements within countries or limited humanitarian access, including to refugee or IDP camps, to avoid spreading the virus even further. These things have had a direct impact on the family links services and the Red Cross movement's ability to carry out tracing at the same speed as before, or even simply to put families back in contact, as staff have not had anything like the same level of access to affected populations to distribute and collect Red Cross messages.
Cross-border family reunifications, which involve transferring a child from one country to be reunited with their family in another country, for which the ICRC is normally the humanitarian actor in charge of working with the authorities, have been complicated by different and interlinked factors. The border and embassy closures are an administrative hurdle. Accessing the child, which is never straightforward, has been made more challenging due to ongoing restrictions. The unaccompanied child's safety and supervision are problematic when one or several quarantines are necessary. Also, sometimes families can be afraid that the incoming child will be seen as bringing the virus into the community and will be stigmatized or worse.
As mentioned earlier, there is a fourth immediate challenge. It is too early to have detailed statistics from areas where ICRC works, but it appears that the worsening socio-economic situation is driving an increase in early child marriage, particularly when so many girls are out of school. Several children in one of the countries in the Sahel who were ready to be reunified with their families and whose reunifications were put on standby when the border closed have now refused to return to their families, as they married in the interim, clearly as a survival mechanism.
In the coming months, it is going to be very important to work with the authorities, other actors and the Red Cross Restoring Family Links program volunteers to ensure that these services can continue and that unaccompanied, displaced and migrant children are not exposed to greater risks than they already are.
Let us also remember that violations of international humanitarian law concerning children were already in existence. These have continued and have been exacerbated. Unfortunately, the recruitment by and the association of children with armed forces and armed groups continues to expose children to extreme levels of violence, risk and trauma.
In times of socio-economic hardships and when school is no longer an option, the push factors for children to join armed groups increase. Also, because of COVID-19, the authorities may have less access to areas where child recruitment is taking place, and official programs that aim to support children to leave armed groups may be reduced in scope.
View Garnett Genuis Profile
CPC (AB)
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
It is quite striking that we have a case of Canadian children detained abroad whose captors wish to release them, but the Government of Canada is not putting in place the conditions to facilitate that release. Mr. Champ made the observation that this is as if all that was required for the two Michaels to be released was for us to go and pick them up and we failed to do that.
Mr. Champ, I think that in some ways it's worse than that. It's as if, having received the offer, we had gone and picked up one of the Michaels and left the other behind, because Canada did launch an operation to bring one person out of northern Syria and then inexplicably said they couldn't do any more.
I would like to ask specifically for your reactions, Mr. Mohammed and Mr. Champ, to the testimony of the previous foreign affairs minister. I raised these issues with Minister Champagne on November 24 before this committee. I asked him why it was possible to repatriate one Canadian child but not the rest. He said that essentially “there was only one Canadian orphan who was in [the] camp”. He said, “That's why we could mount a very extraordinary mission to repatriate her.”
He said: “We had one orphan, and we brought her back. We should all be happy with that.” That's a direct quote: “We should all be happy with that.” I wonder if you had an opportunity to hear the minister's testimony on the 24th and if you want to react to that part or any other part of the minister's testimony on that day.
Maybe we can hear Mr. Mohammed first and then Mr. Champ.
Justin Mohammed
View Justin Mohammed Profile
Justin Mohammed
2021-03-11 15:59
I did have the opportunity to review the former minister's intervention on this point and can only hope that we will change course, noting that we have a new minister in place now.
Mr. Genuis, in response to your question, I think it is very much apparent that there's no clear articulation. Even the Prime Minister has indicated that the case of the one orphan who was repatriated was exceptional, and I would interrogate what exactly was exceptional about that case. Of course Amira was an orphan, but that doesn't change the fact that the other children remaining in this camp still have their rights intact and that the many rights under the Convention on the Rights of the Child, for example, are being violated as much for the other children remaining in that situation as they were for the orphaned child.
Those of course include, for example, article 3 in the Convention on the Rights of the Child, to act within their best interest; article 8, with respect to nationality and identity; and article 9, with respect to being separated from parents without will. Those are the considerations we think should be guiding any future efforts that the Government of Canada should be taking on this.
Paul Champ
View Paul Champ Profile
Paul Champ
2021-03-11 16:00
I agree with everything Mr. Mohammed said.
As an international human rights lawyer, I'm ashamed of Canada's response to this situation. We know the argument that Canada put forward—that they simply couldn't do it and it wasn't possible—was just a flimsy argument, because they did it for one child. How they can do it for one child and not others? I don't know if there's ever any kind of rational response to that statement that could be satisfactory to anyone. It's certainly not satisfactory to me and the other human rights advocates.
View Peter Fonseca Profile
Lib. (ON)
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Mr. Kamarotos, in November 2020 the DCI released comments on children's rights in the digital environment. Many recommendations were made by your organization on how Canada can effectively attempt to create due diligence procedures to protect children from business enterprise.
Alex Kamarotos
View Alex Kamarotos Profile
Alex Kamarotos
2021-03-11 16:01
This issue is quite new. The general comment of the UNCRC has been adopted recently during the COVID period, and member states, including Canada, have to work very closely on this. As you mentioned, the complexity is that it doesn't depend only on public measures, but also on private companies. I think Parliament should adopt legislation putting limits on this—and there is good practice in other countries—and they could also implement the recommendations of general comment 25. That's for the moment, but I think we are going to work closely.
If you permit me, I wanted also to add something to the previous questions, although I was not requested. DCI has been in a group called the Child Justice Advocacy Group, working specifically on cases like the one we have been discussing. There is a position paper called “Children – not terrorists....” that I will put at the disposal of the clerk to distribute to the members who are interested.
View Stéphane Bergeron Profile
BQ (QC)
I understand that Mr. Kamarotos would have liked to add something else in response to a question from Mr. Fonseca. I, for one, felt there was something missing. So if Mr. Kamarotos would like to add to his answer, I offer him the opportunity to do so.
Alex Kamarotos
View Alex Kamarotos Profile
Alex Kamarotos
2021-03-11 16:35
It’ll be my pleasure.
In fact, on the issue of repatriation of children accused of terrorism, there is currently a position statement not only from DCI, but also from a large number of reputable child justice NGOs. In this document, we clearly recommend the repatriation of children.
I also want to mention that the UN Committee on the Rights of the Child in Geneva has been seized of this issue and has already received individual appeals under the third protocol. So this issue could take on international dimensions.
I have already forwarded to the clerk the position statement on this issue. It will be translated and forwarded to all members of the committee.
Thank you very much for giving me the opportunity to add this clarification.
View Stéphane Bergeron Profile
BQ (QC)
Thank you, Mr. Kamarotos.
I really liked Mr. Genuis's analogy that it was as if we had repatriated one of the two Michaels and left the other behind.
The question still troubles me today. Why do you think the Canadian government is refusing to do what other countries have been able to do despite the absence of representatives on the ground, namely to repatriate their nationals trapped in refugee camps in northern Syria?
Paul Champ
View Paul Champ Profile
Paul Champ
2021-03-11 16:37
I wasn't sure who it was directed to. I could take a crack at it.
It's very difficult to answer, quite frankly. I was involved in this issue very early. I was representing an individual who was detained in one of those camps in early 2018. There was a great deal of engagement on the issue at that time by the foreign affairs department. It did appear that they were trying to repatriate, but I don't know what's changed since then. I don't know why Canada's policy has changed. It's deeply disappointing. As I said before, I think it's shameful for all of us.
View Heather McPherson Profile
NDP (AB)
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I want to thank all our witnesses and apologize again on behalf of the committee for the break we had to take. It was unavoidable, of course. I certainly would encourage all of the gentlemen who have joined us today to share any additional testimony with the committee in writing so that we can include it in our report.
Like all of you, I'm deeply concerned about what's happening with detained children in Syria, and of course around the world. I dare say we all feel grief for what is happening in these situations.
I would like each of you, very briefly, to touch upon what you feel the long-term impacts will be on the children who have been left in the Syrian camp now for so long in such deplorable conditions.
Perhaps I would start with Mr. Champ.
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