CPC (AB)
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I call this meeting to order. This is meeting number 87 of the Standing Committee on Finance. Orders of the day are pursuant to the order of reference of Monday, May 25, 2015. We are doing clause-by-clause of Bill C-59, an act to implement certain provisions of the budget tabled in Parliament on April 21, 2015 and other measures.
Colleagues, we will obviously go through clause by clause. We will have different officials, depending on which part of the bill we are dealing with. I want to welcome the officials here for part 1.
As you know, a motion was adopted that guides the committee on how long to speak. The three political parties on the committee have five minutes per clause, but as you know, as chair I can grant a little more time if we speak a little longer for certain items and then group other clauses together. Some parties have helpfully indicated which ones they wish to speak to as a priority. I appreciate that very much.
For clause-by-clause consideration pursuant to Standing Order 75(1), consideration of clause 1, the short title, is postponed. The chair will therefore call clause 2 dealing with part 1, amendments to the Income Tax Act and related legislation.
I do not have any amendments for clauses 2 to 28, and I understand that I can group clauses 2 to 10 together.
Mr. Brison.
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Hon. Scott Brison - 11:51
CPC (AB)
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Clause 1, the short title, is deferred. It's postponed to the end. We're on clauses 2 to 10.
Do you want to speak to one of them?
(On clause 2)
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Hon. Scott Brison - 11:51
Hon. Scott Brison - 11:52
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
(Clauses 2 to 10 inclusive agreed to)
The Chair: I understand the NDP would like to speak to clauses 11 and 12.
Mr. Caron.
(On clauses 11 and 12)
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Guy Caron - 11:52
CPC (AB)
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Thank you. That's a good way to start the meeting.
Is there further discussion on clauses 11 and 12?
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Guy Caron - 11:53
CPC (AB)
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Okay, we'll have a recorded vote.
(Clauses 11 and 12 agreed to: yeas 9; nays 0)
The Chair: I'm told I can group clauses 13 to 18 together.
Mr. Brison.
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Hon. Scott Brison - 11:54
CPC (AB)
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Okay. Shall clauses 13 to 17 carry?
(Clause 13 to 17 agreed to)
(On clause 18)
The Chair: On clause 18, Mr. Brison, go ahead.
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Hon. Scott Brison - 11:55
Hon. Scott Brison - 11:58
CPC (AB)
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I understand the NDP wants to deal with clauses 19 to 24 separately.
Mr. Rankin, go ahead on clause 19.
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Murray Rankin - 11:58
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
I have Mr. Brison and then Mr. Caron.
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Hon. Scott Brison - 11:59
Miodrag Jovanovic - 12:05
CPC (AB)
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We're on a broader policy. Let's keep it germane to clause 19. This may be a public policy issue, but I think we should keep it to clause 19, TFSA dollar limits.
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Hon. Scott Brison - 12:05
CPC (AB)
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The question was asked and the question was answered by Mr. Jovanovic who said that members of the public can use various ways to shelter.
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Hon. Scott Brison - 12:06
Hon. Scott Brison - 12:07
Guy Caron - 12:07
Miodrag Jovanovic - 12:10
CPC (AB)
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I assume members want a recorded vote on clause 19.
(Clause 19 agreed to: [See Minutes of Proceedings])
(On clauses 20 to 24)
The Chair: On clauses 20 to 24, do members want to speak to each one?
Mr. Rankin.
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Murray Rankin - 12:12
Hon. Scott Brison - 12:13
Andrew Saxton - 12:13
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
As the chair, I want to thank you also for endorsing the recommendation of the 2007 industry committee report, which recommended changing the accelerated capital cost allowance for manufacturing. I appreciate your recent conversion to that position.
Can we group clauses 20 to 24 together for voting?
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Murray Rankin - 12:16
CPC (AB)
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I will, then, try to group clauses 25 to 28.
An hon. member: I'd like a recorded vote.
(Clauses 25 to 28 inclusive agreed to: yeas 9; nays 0)
The Chair: Thank you.
We'll now move to part 2, “Support for Families”, division 1, Income Tax Act, and perhaps we'll get the officials for division 2 to make their way to the table as well.
I do not have any amendments for clauses 29 to 34, so I will group clauses 29 to 34 together, and I'll go to Mr. Caron.
(On clauses 29 to 34)
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Guy Caron - 12:16
CPC (AB)
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Merci, monsieur Caron.
I'll go to the vote on clauses 29 to 34.
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Hon. Scott Brison - 12:17
Hon. Scott Brison - 12:17
Hon. Scott Brison - 12:20
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
I'm advised that I can group together clauses 29 and 30 for a vote.
Mr. Raymond Côté (Beauport—Limoilou, NDP): I'd like a recorded vote.
(Clauses 29 and 30 agreed to: yeas 6; nays 3)
The Chair: I'll move to the vote on clauses 31 to 34.
Mr. Guy Caron: I'd like a recorded vote.
(Clauses 31 to 34 inclusive agreed to: yeas 5; nays 4)
The Chair: We'll now move to division 2.
Welcome to the officials from Finance and ESDC.
I do not have any amendments for clauses 35 to 40.
(On clauses 35 to 40)
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Guy Caron - 12:22
Hon. Scott Brison - 12:23
CPC (AB)
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Okay, Mr. Brison, to the actual clauses we're debating.....
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Hon. Scott Brison - 12:24
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
That is probably technically pre-writ advertising, but we'll go to Mr. Saxton and then Mr. Rankin.
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Andrew Saxton - 12:25
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
We'll go to Mr. Rankin and then we'll go to the vote.
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Murray Rankin - 12:26
CPC (AB)
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We'll grant that request. We'll have a recorded vote on clauses 35 to 40.
(Clauses 35 to 40 inclusive agreed to: yeas 8; nays 1)
The Chair: We'll thank our officials from that part and division for being with us.
We will now move to part 3 and we'll move to division 1. We'll ask our officials to come forward. We have an official from Finance. We'll welcome back, Mr. Recker.
(On clause 41)
The Chair: Colleagues, on clause 41 we have four amendments from Ms. May and Mr. Hyer. PV-1 and PV-2 are identical, so we're going to move to amendment PV-2 in the name of Mr. Hyer. We're going to ask Mr. Hyer to present the logic for his amendment.
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Bruce Hyer - 12:28
CPC (AB)
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Thank you very much, Mr. Hyer.
We'll go to Mr. Saxton on this.
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Andrew Saxton - 12:29
CPC (AB)
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We'll then move to the vote on amendment PV-2. The vote on amendment PV-2 obviously also applies to amendment PV-1.
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
The Chair: We will now move to amendment PV-4, because amendment PV-4 is identical to amendment PV-3. Again we will ask Mr. Hyer to address that.
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Bruce Hyer - 12:29
CPC (AB)
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Is there any further discussion on amendment PV-4?
Mr. Saxton.
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Andrew Saxton - 12:30
CPC (AB)
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Thank you. We'll move to the vote on PV-4.
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
The Chair: Shall clause 41 carry?
Did you want to speak to clause 41, Mr. Brison?
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Hon. Scott Brison - 12:31
Andrew Saxton - 12:32
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
(Clause 41 agreed to on division)
The Chair: Mr. Recker, thank you so much.
(On clause 42—Enactment)
The Chair: We'll move to division 2, the prevention of terrorist travel act, and deal with clause 42. We have a number of amendments for clause 42.
We have PV-5 and PV-6, and they are identical, but I will go to PV-6 in the name of Mr. Hyer and ask him to speak to that amendment.
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Bruce Hyer - 12:33
Andrew Saxton - 12:34
CPC (AB)
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Thank you. We'll move to the vote on PV-6.
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
The Chair: We'll move to PV-8 since it's identical to PV-7, and we'll go back to Mr. Hyer, please.
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Bruce Hyer - 12:35
Andrew Saxton - 12:35
Murray Rankin - 12:36
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
The Chair: We'll go to PV-10, which is identical to PV-9.
Mr. Hyer, please.
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Bruce Hyer - 12:37
Andrew Saxton - 12:37
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
The Chair: I understand that PV-11 and PV-12 are identical as well.
Mr. Hyer, on PV-11.
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Bruce Hyer - 12:38
Andrew Saxton - 12:38
CPC (AB)
Murray Rankin - 12:38
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
(Clause 42 agreed to)
(Clause 43 agreed to)
The Chair: Thank you to our officials from Public Safety. We'll now move to—
Mr. Andrew Saxton: Mr. Chair, can we take a break?
The Chair: You want to take a break? Okay.
We'll suspend for 10 minutes and we'll take a food break. Thank you.
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CPC (AB)
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I call this meeting back to order.
Colleagues, we left off at part 3, division 3, dealing with intellectual property. We want to welcome our officials from Industry Canada for this division.
(On clauses 44 to 53)
The Chair: I do not have any amendments for clauses 44 to 53. Can I group those clauses together?
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Raymond Côté - 12:52
CPC (AB)
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Does someone want to speak to clauses 44 to 53?
Monsieur Côté.
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Raymond Côté - 12:52
Raymond Côté - 13:00
Hon. Scott Brison - 13:01
CPC (AB)
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Okay. Thank you.
(Clauses 44 to 53 inclusive agreed to)
(On clause 54)
The Chair: We'll move then to clause 54. We have PV-13 and PV-14, and they are identical. Therefore, we'll go to PV-14.
Mr. Hyer, please.
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Bruce Hyer - 13:04
CPC (AB)
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Thank you, Mr. Hyer.
On this, Ms. Bateman, please.
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Joyce Bateman - 13:04
CPC (AB)
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Okay. Thank you.
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
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Raymond Côté - 13:07
CPC (AB)
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Shall clause 54 carry?
(Clause 54 agreed to on division)
(Clauses 55 to 65 inclusive agreed to)
(On clause 66)
The Chair: We have clause 66. We have two amendments, but they are identical. Therefore, I will go to Green Party amendment 16 and I'll ask Mr. Hyer to address PV-16, please.
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Bruce Hyer - 13:08
CPC (AB)
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Thank you, Mr. Hyer.
Ms. Bateman, on this point.
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Joyce Bateman - 13:10
CPC (AB)
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Okay. I will call the vote on PV-16.
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
The Chair: Do you want to speak to clause 66?
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Raymond Côté - 13:10
CPC (AB)
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Okay, thank you.
(Clause 66 agreed to)
(Clauses 67 to 72 inclusive agreed to)
(On clauses 73 to 80)
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CPC (AB)
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We'll thank our officials from Industry Canada for being with us.
We'll bring forward officials for division 4. Division 4 deals with compassionate leave and benefits. If I am allowed I will group clauses 73 to 80, and we'll go to Mr. Rankin on those clauses.
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Murray Rankin - 13:14
Hon. Scott Brison - 13:15
Murray Rankin - 13:16
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
Are there any further comments?
An hon. member: Let's have a recorded vote.
The Chair: Can we apply it to clauses 73 to 80? Okay, we'll do a recorded vote that applies to these clauses.
(Clause 73 to 80 agreed to: yeas 9; nays 0)
The Chair: I want to thank our officials. I'm sorry we didn't have any tough questions for you today, but clearly you did your work very well.
(On clause 81)
The Chair: We will then move to division 5 dealing with the Copyright Act, and we'll ask the officials from Heritage to come forward. Welcome to the committee and thank you for being with us.
Colleagues, we have four amendments, but two are identical, so we'll deal with PV-18 and PV-20 and we'll go to Mr. Hyer.
Mr. Hyer, you can speak to them separately or together as you so wish.
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Bruce Hyer - 13:17
CPC (AB)
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Okay, thank you very much, Mr. Hyer.
On this point, Mr. Cannan.
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Hon. Ron Cannan - 13:18
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
All in favour of amendment PV-18?
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
The Chair: All in favour of amendment PV-20?
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
The Chair: All those in favour of clause 81?
Monsieur Côté.
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Raymond Côté - 13:19
CPC (AB)
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Okay.
Thank you.
(Clause 81 agreed to)
(Clause 82 agreed to)
The Chair: We'll thank our officials from Heritage.
We'll then move to division 6, on the Export Development Act. We have some amendments in this division. We'll welcome our officials back from Foreign Affairs and from Finance.
I'll deal with clause 83. There are no amendment to clause 83.
Mr. Brison, please go ahead.
(On clause 83)
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Hon. Scott Brison - 13:22
CPC (AB)
Steven Kuhn - 13:23
Hon. Scott Brison - 13:25
Murray Rankin - 13:25
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
(Clause 83 agreed to)
(On clause 84)
The Chair: We will go to clause 84, and we will go to NDP-1, then.
Mr. Rankin, do you want to speak to that?
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Murray Rankin - 13:26
CPC (AB)
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Thank you, Mr. Rankin.
I'll go to Mr. Saxton.
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Andrew Saxton - 13:27
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
We'll go to further discussion.
Mr. Rankin.
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Murray Rankin - 13:27
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
We'll then vote on NDP-1.
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
The Chair: We have PV-21 and PV-22, so we'll go back to Mr. Hyer, for that amendment. We'll deal with PV-22.
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Bruce Hyer - 13:28
Andrew Saxton - 13:29
CPC (AB)
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Thank you, Mr. Saxton.
We'll go then to PV-22.
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
(Clause 84 agreed to)
(On clause 85)
The Chair: On clause 85, we have NDP-2.
Mr. Rankin.
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Murray Rankin - 13:30
Andrew Saxton - 13:32
CPC (AB)
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Okay, thank you.
We'll go then to the vote on NDP-2.
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
(Clause 85 agreed to)
(Clause 86 agreed to)
The Chair: We'll thank our two officials for being here for this division.
We will move then to division 7 dealing with the Canada Labour Code. We have a series of amendments on this division.
I don't have any amendments for clauses 87 and 88.
(On clause 87)
The Chair: Speaking to clause 87, Mr. Rankin and then Mr. Brison.
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Murray Rankin - 13:34
Murray Rankin - 13:34
CPC (AB)
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For sure.
We'll go then to Mr. Brison on this clause.
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Hon. Scott Brison - 13:35
Hon. Scott Brison - 13:38
CPC (AB)
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Thank you. We'll have a recorded vote on clause 87.
(Clause 87 agreed to: yeas 9; nays 0)
(Clause 88 agreed to)
(On clause 89)
The Chair: We have a series of amendments to clause 89. Again if members wish to address them together or separately, that's their choice.
We'll start with NDP-3, and we go to Mr. Rankin.
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Murray Rankin - 13:39
CPC (AB)
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I will allow you some flexibility in how you address your amendments.
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Murray Rankin - 13:40
CPC (AB)
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In terms of the vote...? You could address them all together if you want to do that.
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Murray Rankin - 13:40
CPC (AB)
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You can address the whole topic and then we could do the votes after.
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Murray Rankin - 13:40
CPC (AB)
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Let's go to NDP-4 and NDP-5 after the Green Party.
Thank you, Mr. Rankin.
On this point, we'll hear Mr. Adler, please.
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Mark Adler - 13:44
Murray Rankin - 13:46
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
We'll vote on NDP-3, and I'm advised the vote on NDP-3 applies to NDP-7.
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
The Chair: Colleagues, we'll do PV-24, hopefully before question period, and we'll go to Mr. Hyer.
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Bruce Hyer - 13:49
CPC (AB)
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Thank you, Mr. Hyer.
On this point, Mr. Adler.
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Mark Adler - 13:49
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
The Chair: We'll suspend the meeting now and we'll resume at 3:15 p.m.
Thank you.
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CPC (AB)
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I call this meeting back to order.
This is meeting 87 of the Standing Committee on Finance. We are continuing our clause-by-clause discussion of Bill C-59.
We are at division 7, clause 89. Within this clause we have amendments NDP-4, NDP-5, and NDP-6.
We'll go to Mr. Rankin for NDP-4 or for all of them together.
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Murray Rankin - 15:15
Mark Adler - 15:22
CPC (AB)
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The member addressed NDP-4, NDP-5, and NDP-6.
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Mark Adler - 15:23
CPC (AB)
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I'm sorry. I think Mr. Rankin just did NDP-4 and NDP-5.
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Murray Rankin - 15:24
CPC (AB)
Murray Rankin - 15:24
CPC (AB)
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—but we'll come back to NDP-6.
All in favour of NDP-4?
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Murray Rankin - 15:24
CPC (AB)
Murray Rankin - 15:24
Murray Rankin - 15:24
Mark Adler - 15:25
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
We will then go to NDP-4.
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
The Chair: We'll do the vote on NDP-5.
(Amendment negatived [See Minutes of Proceedings])
The Chair: We'll go to NDP-6.
On that, Mr. Rankin.
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Murray Rankin - 15:26
Mark Adler - 15:28
Hon. Scott Brison - 15:28
CPC (AB)
Murray Rankin - 15:29
Hon. Scott Brison - 15:30
CPC (AB)
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We'll move to the vote on amendment NDP-6, then.
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Guy Caron - 15:31
CPC (AB)
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We'll have a recorded vote on amendment NDP-6.
(Amendment negatived: nays 5; yeas 4 [See Minutes of Proceedings])
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CPC (AB)
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We'll have a recorded vote on clause 89. Can we apply it to clauses 89 to 91, or just on clause 89?
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Guy Caron - 15:32
CPC (AB)
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We have amendment NDP-8, so we'll go to the NDP. Mr. Rankin.
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Murray Rankin - 15:32
Mark Adler - 15:34
Murray Rankin - 15:36
CPC (AB)
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Thank you.
We will have a recorded vote on amendment NDP-8.
(Amendment negatived; nays 6; yeas 3 [See Minutes of Proceedings])
(Clause 92 agreed to)
(Clause 93 agreed to)
(On clauses 94 to 96)
The Chair: We thank the officials for that division for being with us here today. We will now move on to division 8, Members of Parliament Retiring Allowances Act, clauses 94 to 96. I do not have any amendments for this division. Can I group clauses 94 to 96 together?
On clause 94, go ahead, Mr. Brison.
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Hon. Scott Brison - 15:38
Hon. Scott Brison - 15:40
CPC (AB)
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Does that clarify it? Thank you.
Can I group the votes together then? Or should we do them separately?
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Hon. Scott Brison - 15:40
CPC (AB)
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Okay. I'll take them separately.
(Clause 94 agreed to)
(Clause 95 agreed to)
(Clause 96 agreed to)
(On clause 97)
The Chair: Thank you, Ms. Gowing, for being here. We appreciate your participation.
We shall move on to division 9, the National Energy Board Act. It has one clause, clause 97.
We shall welcome officials from Natural Resources, and on clause 97 we have two amendments by the Green Party.
I'll just give you a heads-up, Mr. Hyer. I do have a ruling, but I'll give you time to speak to your amendment here.
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Bruce Hyer - 15:41
Bruce Hyer - 15:42
CPC (AB)
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Thank you very much, Mr. Hyer.
I have a ruling as the chair on this amendment.
Bill C-59 amends the National Energy Act by altering the maximum period for the duration of export licences. This amendment proposes to re-establish the maximum period for the duration of export licences that is currently in the act. As House of Commons Procedure and Practice, second edition, states on page 766, “An amendment to a bill that was referred to a committee after second reading is out of order if it is beyond the scope and principle of the bill”.
In the opinion of the chair, therefore, this amendment attempts to maintain the maximum duration period for export licences that is currently in the National Energy Act. This is contrary to the principle of the bill, which is to establish a new maximum duration period for export licences. Therefore, this amendment is inadmissible.
Is there further discussion on clause 97?
Monsieur Caron.
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Guy Caron - 15:44