AANR Committee Meeting

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

Meeting No. 69

Tuesday, May 6, 2003

The Standing Committee on Aboriginal Affairs, Northern Development and Natural Resources met in a televised session at 9:31 a.m. this day, in Room 237-C, Centre Block, the Chair, Raymond Bonin, presiding.

Members of the Committee present: Gérard Binet, Raymond Bonin, Stan Dromisky, John Godfrey, Charles Hubbard, Nancy Karetak-Lindell, Pat Martin, Anita Neville, Julian Reed, Maurice Vellacott.

Acting Members present: Réal Ménard for Yvan Loubier, Karen Redman for Benoît Serré, Paddy Torsney for John Godfrey, Colleen Beaumier for Nancy Karetak-Lindell, Mario Laframboise for Serge Cardin, Joe McGuire for Julian Reed, Joe McGuire for Benoît Serré, Myron Thompson for Brian Pallister, Dominic LeBlanc for John Godfrey, Janko Peric for Anita Neville, Janko Peric for Benoît Serré, John O’Reilly for Benoît Serré, Dominic LeBlanc for Gérard Binet, Alan Tonks for Gérard Binet, Dominic LeBlanc for Julian Reed, Dominic LeBlanc for Gérard Binet, Dominic LeBlanc for Benoît Serré, Brian Massé for Pat Martin.

In attendance: From the Committees Branch: Jean-Michel Roy, Michael Lukyniuk and Jeffrey LeBlanc, Legislative Clerks; Jean-François Pagé, Committee Clerk.

In attendance: From the Library of Parliament: Mary Hurley and Tonina Simeone, Analysts.

Witnesses: From the Department of Indian Affairs and Northern Development: Warren Johnson, Assistant Deputy Minister, Lands and Trust Services; Paul Salembier, Senior Counsel; Lucie Angers, Senior Counsel, Criminal Law Policy Section, Justice Canada; Catherine MacLean, Counsel, Lands and Trusts, Socio-Economic Policy and Programs and Corporate Services, Justice Canada.

Pursuant to its Order of Reference of Monday, October 7, 2002, the Committee resumed consideration of Bill C-7, An Act respecting leadership selection, administration and accountability of Indian bands, and to make related amendments to other Acts (See Minutes of Proceedings, Monday, January 27, 2003, Meeting No. 14).

The Committee resumed Clause-by-Clause consideration of the Bill.

On Clause 19,

Debate resumed on the amendment of Yvan Loubier – That Bill C-7, in Clause 19, be amended by replacing line 11 on page 14 with the following:

“a term of imprisonment not exceeding six”

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was negatived on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Réal Ménard, Pat Martin (2)

NAYS: Gérard Binet, Stan Dromisky, Paddy Torsney, Charles Hubbard, Anita Neville, Julian Reed, Karen Redman (7)

Charles Hubbard moved, -- That Bill C-7, in Clause 19, be amended by replacing lines 15 and 16 on page 14 with the following:

of a band law made under paragraph 16(1)(e) or 17(1)(a) or (b) may be

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was agreed to on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Réal Ménard, Pat Martin (2)

NAYS: Gérard Binet, Stan Dromisky, John Godfrey, Charles Hubbard, Colleen Beaumier, Anita Neville, Julian Reed, Karen Redman (8)

Réal Ménard moved, --

That Bill C-7, in Clause 19, be amended by replacing line 18 on page 14 with the following:

“$500,000 or a term of imprisonment not”

After debate, Pat Martin moved – That the amendment be further amended by replacing “$500,000” with “$1,000,000”.

At 10:36 a.m., the sitting was suspended for lack of quorum.

At 10:55 a.m., the sitting resumed.

After debate, the question being put on the sub-amendment, it was negatived on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Maurice Vellacott, Mario Laframboise, Pat Martin (3)

NAYS: Gérard Binet, Stan Dromisky, John Godfrey, Charles Hubbard, Nancy Karetak-Lindell, Anita Neville, Julian Reed, Joe McGuire (8)

Debate resumed on the amendment.

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was negatived on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Maurice Vellacott, Mario Laframboise, Pat Martin (3)

NAYS: NAYS: Gérard Binet, Stan Dromisky, John Godfrey, Charles Hubbard, Nancy Karetak-Lindell, Anita Neville, Julian Reed, Joe McGuire (8)

On motion of Maurice Vellacott, it was agreed – That the sitting be suspended.

At 11:47 a.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 12:13 p.m., the sitting resumed.

Mario Laframboise moved, --

That Bill C-7, in Clause 19, be amended by replacing line 19 on page 14 with the following:

“exceeding one year, or by both.”

At 12:17 p.m., the sitting was suspended for lack of quorum.

At 12:20 p.m., the sitting resumed.

At 12:20 p.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 12:25 p.m., the sitting resumed.

Debate resumed on the amendment.

Pat Martin moved – That the motion be further amended by replacing “one year” with “two years”.

At 1:29 p.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 1:30 p.m., the sitting resumed.

After debate, the question being put on the sub-amendment, it was negatived on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Yvan Loubier, Pat Martin (2)

NAYS: NAYS: Gérard Binet, Dominic LeBlanc, Charles Hubbard, Nancy Karetak-Lindell, Anita Neville, Janko Peric, Maurice Vellacott (7)

Debate resumed on the amendment.

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, it was negatived on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Maurice Vellacott, Yvan Loubier, Pat Martin (3)

NAYS: Gérard Binet, Stan Dromisky, Dominic LeBlanc, Charles Hubbard, Anita Neville, Julian Reed, Janko Peric (7)

Clause 19, as amended, carried on division.

Clauses 20, 21, and 22 carried severally on division.

On Clause 23,

Charles Hubbard moved, -- That Bill C-7, in Clause 23, be amended by replacing lines 26 to 38 on page 15 with the following:

Designation of band enforcement officers.

23. (1) The council of a band may employ any person as a band enforcement officer for the purpose of conducting inspections and searches on reserve lands of the band, and shall furnish each officer with a certificate specifying the provisions of band laws in respect of which the officer may conduct them.

Production of certificate

(2) When conducting an inspection or search of a place, a band enforcement officer shall, on request, produce the certificate to the person appearing to be in charge of the place.

On motion of Maurice Vellacott, by unanimous consent, it was agreed – That the word “qualified” be inserted after the words “may employ any”.

At 1:55 p.m., the sitting was suspended.

At 3:35 p.m., the sitting resumed.

Debate resumed on the amendment, as amended.

Pat Martin moved – That the amendment, as amended, be further amended by adding in Clause 23(2) after the word “place”, the following:

“and clearly explain to the person the purpose of the inspection and the nature of the violation the officer suspects may be taking place.”

At 3:54 p.m., the sitting was suspended for lack of quorum.

At 4:00 p.m., the sitting resumed.

After debate, the question being put on the sub-amendment, it was negatived on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Maurice Vellacott, Yvan Loubier, Pat Martin (3)

NAYS: Gérard Binet, John Godfrey, Charles Hubbard, Nancy Karetak-Lindell, Anita Neville, Julian Reed, John O’Reilly (7)

Debate resumed on the amendment, as amended.

Yvan Loubier moved – That the amendment, as amended, be further amended by adding, to paragraph (2), the following:

“apparently responsible for the proposed location (and verify his/her identity)”

After debate, the question being put on the sub-amendment, it was negatived on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Maurice Vellacott, Yvan Loubier, Pat Martin (3)

NAYS: Gérard Binet, Stan Dromisky, Charles Hubbard, Nancy Karetak-Lindell, Anita Neville, Julian Reed, Dominic LeBlanc (7)

On motion of Maurice Vellacott, it was agreed, by unanimous consent – That the amendment, as amended, be further amended by adding after the words “band laws” in Clause 23(1) the following:

“made under section 16 and 17”

After debate, the question being put on the amendment, as amended, it was agreed to on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Gérard Binet, Stan Dromisky, Charles Hubbard, Nancy Karetak-Lindell, Anita Neville, Julian Reed, Dominic LeBlanc, Maurice Vellacott (8)

NAYS: Yvan Loubier, Pat Martin (2)

After debate, Clause 23, as amended, carried on the following recorded division:

YEAS: Gérard Binet, Stan Dromisky, Charles Hubbard, Nancy Karetak-Lindell, Anita Neville, Julian Reed, Dominic LeBlanc (7)

NAYS: Yvan Loubier, Pat Martin, Maurice Vellacott (3)

On Clause 24,

Maurice Vellacott moved, -- That Bill C-7, in Clause 24, be amended by replacing lines 39 to 45 on page 15 and lines 1 to 4 on page 16 with the following:

“24. (1) A band enforcement officer to whom a warrant has been issued under subsection 26(3) may, at any reasonable time, carry out an inspection if the officer believes on reasonable grounds that there is non-compliance with a band law.”

Yvan Loubier moved – That the amendment be further amended by inserting, after the word “inspection”, the following:

“Exclusive of living quarters”

At 6:09 p.m., the Committee adjourned to the call of the Chair.

Elizabeth B. Kingston

Clerk of the Committee